Sewing -Noble Threads- Patterns and Progress with Medieval clothes circa50-1650 AD

What an adorable outfit - and so beautifully accessorized too.

Teddy

 

I am in love with this thread. I am a huge Italian Renaissance enthusiast and want to learn to make my own accurate Period clothing in 1/4 size, so the information here should help with that. I'm terrible at sewing though, so I probably will get disheartened easily.

 

I know that there are a plethora of hand-weavers about..while it might not be a LOT of fabric, you might be able to ask one for the 'loom waste'..the last inches or feet of cloth woven that holds the finished piece in place on the loom. Also. handkerchiefs can be purchased in bulk on Ebay, and I imagine on crafting sites like Tophatter.

From experience, I would advise against redying a print a darker color to 'cover' it. Even very good dyes will 'take' differently on different areas, in other words, a print with light spaces will be a lighter color than the dark spaces. If what you're looking for is a uniform dark color, buy that. You can always use the objectionable print in something else. It is possible to remove color, but the process can be hard on the fabric. Cheap dyes like RIT contain salt, which destroy the protein based threads of silk, creating a 'shattering' effect.

Secondly, have any of you gone to the Rialto? There's info here: SCA-Rialto-FAQ as well as links, to talk to others who are into medieval and Renaissance costuming. You may even run into a merchant or three, who can hook you up with resources.


Would this be of help to anyone? http://www.amazon.com/Elizabethan-C...9973319&sr=8-1&keywords=elizabethan+costuming


This lady, Janet Stephens has done quite a lot of research on period hairstyles, particularly early period Roman, Greek, and so on. I'd like to recreate her seni crines hairstyle and Vestal clothing (the result at the end of the video is a dead ringer for the statue of Concordia Harmonia, the last Vestal. But..what wig to use for such a project?

Note: Just one hairstyle more to the date of this forum:

 

Not if they want accuracy.

It's a nice enough book but research has moved on a lot since it was written. If you want accuracy in costume you'd be better off going for The Tudor Tailor by Ninya Mikhaila and and Jane Malcolm-Davies (the same press has also published well reserached books on Tudor menswear, lower class clothing and children's Tudor & Elizabethan garments) - The Tudor Tailor – The Tudor Tailor

Teddy

 

Ah..thank you. I thought the sewing tips and drawings might be of use. Thank you for the mention of more accurate sources.

 

I've just had a chance to watch some of the those hairdressing videos - thanks for sharing those, I had no idea they existed, and they're so useful


Teddy

 

For Renaissance, most SCA sites should help. I got most of my tips from an IRL friend at the local Renaissance Faire, who also has a copy of the Tudor Tailor (in fact, she says she thinks she has an extra copy, and when she finds it, she's passing it on).

Some things to keep in mind:
1. Most garments were made with straight lines. Look at this page and start by making a chemise (floor-length for a woman, hip-length for a man, calf-length for a small child). It is literally 2 rectangles for the body and 2 for the sleeves.

As long as the hems and seam allowances are all on the INSIDE, your finished chemise should look just fine.

2. Elastic instead of drawstrings is NOT period, but it's a ton easier to dress and undress your doll that way and nobody will really notice. Trust me, thread that drawstring channel with elastic, not ribbon. It's no harder to do, and you'll save yourself headaches later.

3. Make a toile. ALWAYS ALWAYS make a toile, especially if you're making your own pattern from scratch. A toile is a mock-up on really cheap fabric (or even paper towels, for tinies) that lets you see if your pattern's right. Once the toile fits your doll properly, THEN you're ready to make the real thing. (Plus, you WILL screw up your first attempt at anything, take it from an experienced sewist. You really want your first, ugly garment to be a cheap muslin toile, NOT a fancy brocade gown! My toiles for my doll's kirtle on the previous page of this thread were ugly as sin.)

4. Don't get discouraged by weird mistakes in the early stages. Like I said, your first attempt will never look quite right. It's part of learning. We've all made weird mistakes--sewing one pant leg inside-out, turning the hem to the outside instead of the inside, etc. It gets a lot easier with practice, and as long as you're making a toile, at least your mistakes aren't in anything expensive.

5. Press every single seam. It makes your garment look nicer, and only takes a moment.

 

Neither are drawstrings. There's no evidence for them before the vary late 16th or early 17th Century, as far as I'm aware.

They are, however, very useful when an adjustable fit would come in handy.

Teddy

 

Thank you so much for all of this information. I'm starting out by hand sewing a dress for my YoSD from a pattern I bought on Etsy. It's not period or anything, but I need to learn how patterns go together and it's a good way to practice. I've just been using old shirts I have. I have a sewing machine, but prefer to hand sew and of course, hand-sewing is period appropriate. Do you hand-sew? I have tried sewing with a machine on doll clothing and they are just too small for me to maneuver on the machine.
I've never even thought about using a toile (never even heard of this word), so thank you so much for explaining that. I'm feeling more confident now

 

Hello!
Spending a whole month at home after orthopaedic surgery and reading "Catherine" by J. Benzoni again, I decided to make a "burgundian gown" for my just adopted Sunniva (Iplehouse YID+Yur head). Sure, the heroine of the novel lived cca 40-50 years before this type dress+hat were fashionable, but who cares, I always imagined her with tall hennin and deep neckline . Applying so called "CDD system" (i.e. "what the household offered" in Czech lang.) almost everything that was used was from my overgrown supplies, except the mink plush for "ermine" trims. The texts by M. Cadieux and Mistress Corisander, once upon a time downloaded, were very helpful for making pattern of the gown and understanding, how the hats were constructed and fashioned.
The chosen fabrics (silk/viscose velvet and cotsilk batiste) were too fine, so I sandwiched each piece with a more firm fabric - so the gown and underdress are not lined in modern ways at all. Doll's hands were really problematic - it was not possible to make the long sleeves narrow without some cheating. The sleeves are not sewn together up to elbow, and there are hidden lacing rings on the bias cut sleeves of the gown, and lacing holes on the chemise sleeves. The front seam of the gown is also laced up, I do not like it very much, but I do not find another method, how to close the garment.
The hats are from cardboard and surprise - they do not fall off her head! Both veils are rectangular, for the "butterfly hennin" (my family called it "curtain-drying rack") I used sturdier polyester chiffon, and a finest silk chiffon I had for the one with velvet hem.... All sewn by hand (too much free time + I am crazy).

 

Beautifully done.

Teddy

 

very impressive, and i love the picture on the lavender lined path. is that your garden?

 

Bravo! Far better use of recovery time than what I seem to manage. >///< Love the curtain drying racks! ;D

 

Stunning.

 

Thank you very much, and no, it is not my garden, unfortunately - but Photoshop is a great helper.

 

OH!! Dezi that's amazing! I love the hat. so lovely

 

I got an offer to work SCA 50 Year Celebration, so I brought Rina with me. She was naked when we arrived, so I slapped together a nursing nun's habit, complete with girdle (quickly kumihimo braided), and paternoster, out of seed beads and fake amber. I even found a super tiny cross. I wish I had the wherewithal to make her a little chirurgeon badge. It's based on a Norse style tunic, with gores, and the Little Sisters of the Poor.

 

Oh well done!!

Teddy

 

Thanks! Hand sewing is hard, but at least she's no longer settling for my headscarf.

 

@Rosslyn It neatly hides the fact that this event is how I earned enough to get her wig and the pointy ears. She's supposed to be a doctor mundanely anyway, so a nursing sister/Chirurgeon seemed to make sense.

 

I know this is a bit later than the thread specifies, being Italian Renaissance rather then Medieval, but here's a gown I made for my Raccoondoll Laetitia anyway:


It was my first attempt at a Renaissance gown, so there is definitely room for improvement. I used taffeta instead of a more drapey fabric, as I couldn't find any that looked even vaguely historically accurate, so the gown ended up far too stiff in the skirt. I'm quite pleased with the sleeves but the bodice needs work - the two layers meant the front gown didn't fit that great, (I ended up having to add an extra panel to the front) so next time I think I will make just one layer and fake a chemise instead! Also the bodice isn't that accurate - it's shaped with darts, as I just couldn't find any information about how bodices were actually shaped at the time. A front panel and a side front piece, maybe? I really don't know!

Anyway, I do love the colour on her, and I'm glad she finally has clothes! And I'm pleased I finally made some historical clothes - I'm planning on many more!

 

It's beautiful!

 

There wasn't any fornt shapin g to speak of - the bodice shaped the body (and resin doesn't squish so you can't do that) and mostly the bdoices were one piece from centre front to side back (where they laced to the back piece), like this:
http://realmofvenus.renaissanceitaly.net/yourgarb/2008/Sunny-ele2.jpg

If you're doing a front-opening style you coould shape at the centre front (make the centre-front edges like a flattened S shape instead of straight up-and-down) and I'd suggest "cheating" and adding in a side seam (mostly hidden by the arms when worn anyway) so you can get extra fabric in there for her bust shaping.

My solution was to make the dress for a doll with a fairly small bust (and I really should have given her a chemise to provide some padding and prevent her nipples from poking so obviously at the bodice fabric):

Teddy

 

Ah, now here is where the seamstresses of old would cheat. You can get stretch in pieces by cutting on the bias. Here's a little post about just that.

Recreating 16th and 17th Century Clothing: The Renaissance Tailor

 

Ah, I see! That's such useful information - and the dress you made is BEAUTIFUL!!!
Yes, I suspected it might be one of those things that relied on squishing bodies - that resin doesn't! So you end up having to decide between actually being historically accurate, or ignoring the correct techniques to get the right "look". Ah well.
I wondered about making a bodice that goes below the bust instead, with a gathered chemise to cover the bust - much like they do in the tv show "The Borgias" - but I have my doubts about the accuracy of the tv show costuming. But, yeah, I did have a lot of trouble finding accurate references for specifically Italian Renaissance dress - lots on medieval and tudor, but not much on that! But I'm going to keep researching, as it's such a beautiful era to sew for. Thank you very much for your advice, it's always so helpful - and I've read a lot of this thread! It's so nice to see all the beautiful clothes people make!

Ooh thank you, that's really helpful! What a great resource that site is, too!

 

Try here: The Realm Of Venus - Fashion and Style in Renaissance Italy

Teddy

 

Oh wow, that's great! Thank you so much!!!

 

You're welcome

Bella's pages are very helpful and informative, and she's been costuming for many years (I dread to think how long ago we first encountered each other on the H-costume forum, but it must have been some time in the early 90's), and are one of my firtst stops if I ned to look up something relating to costume in Renaissance Italy.

Teddy

 

I made this ensemble for a contest:

 

The coat is a lovely style

Teddy

 

This coat is great! I like the front closure

 

I got it into my mind to make and 1250(-ish) outfit for one of my dolls.
So far I got leg wear and a shirt.

Please excuse the headlessness, this guy is currently not sure about who he wants to be.

 

I love the tie details on the hose.

 

Excellent work

Teddy

 

Thank you. One of my favourite things about historical clothes is all the layers and how it all goes together.
I'm still looking for a good way to make points for the ties, though. Here I just stiffened the ends with a bit of glue, but I wish I could figure out some way to make metal ones or at least metal-looking ones.

Thank you very much!

 

Thank you! I'll have to try that.

 

Sad to see so many of the old pictures down, but the discussion and pictures that are still here are very inspiring!

 

If you want to go really extra you can always try to foil the ends XD

 

I am still lurking about this awesome thread...and as soon as time allows, I will be all over this idea. I am obsessed with all things medieval/fantasy and 2 of my characters' stories involve a faerie ring and unintentional time travel.

I dug these out, which I had made a long while ago for an old Tonner male that I no longer have...so Vex reluctantly agreed to try them on. She doesn't love the fact that her hands are hidden in the sleeves, as it makes typing rather difficult, but I promised her a new lip color very soon if she cooperated, so.....

tunic1

tunic5

tunic4

tunic3

tunic2

I have some chemises, and some simple sheath gowns for under surcoats and such somewhere...I just need to locate them. Hmmmm......

 

It's a nice outfit and she looks like she's borrowed it from a boyfriend or older brother.

Teddy

 

Good point! Thanks.

 

One of the moderators took the pics of my valentine scene from the "what are you currently crafting" thread and replaced them by accident here. Don't know why.
Sorry can't help this at this moment. UPDATE: almost solved my pics have been removed by moderator only my reply to MBLilac still has to be gone. Moderator will do that .

 

What the heck? Are they going to fix it for you. This is nuts.

 

That is super weird. :/

 

So sorry @Changeling Pics are removed by moderator now. I just asked her to also remove my reply ( sent in an other topic before)
to MBLilac. Never saw this topic until my Valentine pics arrived here suddenly .

 

Quick mod note; the mod team is only human, so we do sometimes make mistakes. Any accidental changes to your posts can usually be undone, and if not, you can always make another to post the same content.

 

After only two years of having my poor Arthur standing around nekkid, I have finally gathered my courage and made him some clothes. There are more photos in his flickr album.

Sandals do not feature in the Late Roman reference I used, but I got this mini-David Kuncci in the original launch package, and that included geta feet. They were too good not to use! Also included in the set were a pair of transparent hand parts, which were a great help in working with the tight sleeves that tunics of this epoch have.

Arthur by severelysigune, on Flickr

 

Most impressive.


Teddy

 

That's quite authentic for the Arthurian ie late Roman-British period! Love the trousers LOL

 

Me again...just buttin in with a question, as this seems to be the thread with the most knowledge on this subject.
I desperately desire a pattern for my 60cm Supia female which resembles this:
1476ff7d78cf3e4dbea2322da1bdd0a1

Do any of you know where I may acquire one? I have searched high and low, and do not feel quite confident enough to fashion one myself...if you know anyone who makes and sells such patterns for 1/3 bjd of this nature, I would be most appreciative!!!

*edit: Perhaps it I take a regular long sleeve shirt pattern, lengthen it and add gores at the sides? Just a simple kirtle is all I wish.

He looks Fantastic!!!!!

 

I have a commercial made pattern at home for a human dress like that. Once the work day is over and I've managed to crawl the weary bones home I'll check my pattern catalog/collection for the pattern details =).
Also pretty sure that someone else on DoA has made those dresses and posted here on DoA, but for the life of me can't remember where =/.
I've read too many project journal threads to remember the exact details ^^'. Sorry =[

 

Thank you! I had it in my head that medieval clothing was not that complicated, I mean, it's not like they sat and drafted crazy complex patterns, so this makes much sense. I think I will just bust out some of my cheap craft felt and make a few test runs, piecing thinga together as I go the way you just described. I was picturing in my mind a sort of tabard type rectangle then piecing in gores where needed. Does the gown pictured here have gores in the front n back or just the sides? Can I see a photo of the whole thing while your gorgeous doll is standing by chance? To gauge how wide the gores should be at the bottom hemline?

Thank you muchly! Make sure to give your weary bones some rest tho!

Awesome link there! Both methods look very easy to work out, thank you!!!

 

Go here:

/threads/medieval-patterns-for-male-and-female.667038/

All the patterns in that link are based on measurements. So you can measure your doll, use that for the pattern measurement, and there you go.

 

Thank you very much!

I found this image also, and thought it may be useful on doll scale to get full use of fabric:
http://pinterest.com/pin/178314466469374735/?source_app=android

I decided to be brave and try drafting a fairly simple pattern...am crossing my fingers n toes. Lol

Kirtle pattern...

If it turns out I will put it into pdf form and share here.

I will post progress pics here in this post instead of continuing to make separate posts? Don't wish to spam up the whole thread.

Making progress.

Added sleeve extensions.

Nothing fancy but Ophelia seems to like it.

Ugly felt shoes just so she no longer has bare toes. Lol

Enough for the day. She is content until tomorrow.

I remembered I had this el cheapo fabric I got at Goodwill for like 2 dollars...it has some stains here and there but honestly, that just lends to the realism...or that's what I'm telling myself. Lol

Where do you guys buy your tiny trim and eyelets from by chance?

Ok...the pattern actually works and goes together very very easy. I have it uploaded to pdf right now, so of anyone would like it, message me and I can email it to you.

 

What I learned about period trim, I learned from the following page and similar. (Recreating 16th and 17th Century Clothing: The Renaissance Tailor Do check out her other pages regarding trims.) The DIY and layering approaches help me use up my stash and spares me hassle on finding trim. Some of the time.

As to eyelets, I'll use the eye parts of hooks and eyes, or use buttonhole stitch bars for lacing.

 

Fantastic, thank you!!! That link is fantastic!!!