What do you think about Hybrids?

to some ppl , hybrids are acceptable. bcuz of the low cost.
as long as the head can fit with the body and the resin colours goes with it. After the clothes is worn on the body, sometimes other owners dun even recognise that the body is xxx brand, the head is yyy brand, as the clothes covers up the joint parts. unless the other owners take apart the clothes and feel the doll texture.

but to some bjd owners , they maybe veri particular about the brand . like dod head must go with dod body, dod head cannot be used on AA body etc.

in my country, some bjd owners that i know does that and dun mind hybrids.
it is up to indiividuals

 

I don't think it has anything to do with ethics. To me, making a hybrid is a way of customizing your doll. Some people open the eyes, others sand the cheeks and some make a hybrid (and then, you have those who do all the above).

Practically all my dolls are hybrids. It's because I do not like my dolls to have the same body-sculpt. They have different faces, why then would it not be okay to have a different body as well?
Some of the original body-sculpts didn't suit the character. Lord Alikaj for instance, is a very slender man and the Elfdoll-bodies didn't have what I was looking for.
It isn't about lowering cost. Most of the bodies my dolls have are more expensive than the original (darn you Dollstown for making such beautiful sculpts!!).

I do not have the impression that companies worry about hybrids. Bodies from all companies in the doll-fandom are used. So, maybe Luts isn't selling a body to me, because I want a DoD body, but my neighour prefers Luts over DoD. I think it evens out.

 

I agree with Silk, making a hybrid BJD is not an ethical issue in the same way that knock-off dolls are an ethical issue. In one case you are customising your doll, in another you're stealing the work of another and passing it off as your own. In the case of the hybrid, people are all too happy to admit that the head is from one company and the body is from another, and explain the mods they did to get the doll together, and in the case of the knock-off, the seller won't admit that the doll is a fake!

It makes me curious that people assume hybrids are a cheaper option because in many cases they're not. You can pay a lot for a head, particularly on the second-hand market, and tracking down the perfect body can also be expensive. Not everyone who creates a hybrid is doing it to get a full doll on the cheap, they want the posing ability offered by one company and the facial aesthetics of another and that kind of quality doesn't come cheap, particularly if you factor in shipping.

I think some companies would prefer you to buy a full doll from them because it makes them more money in the long run, not because they're worried about 'artistic integrity' or protecting their customers in some way. Personally, I think there are enough WTS threads that show that even if companies won't sell their parts individually, there's enough of a demand for them that people will club together to get the parts they want anyway...and if you think about it, when has any company had the clout to demand that their customers only use their products in a certain way? I doubt someone would accept it if a company said they would not sell televisions and DVD players seperately and you had to buy their products together (loose analogy I know...) What if you only wanted a telly? What if you only needed a DVD player? You'd get together with someone who wanted what you didn't and you'd split the cost...or you'd move on to another company that wasn't so fussy.

 

my hybrid was not cheaper, not easier, took work and time, so its not a case of an easy cheap route for alot of people. its just customization? i like jeongs head, want her to be older, voila = MNF body. i really cant honestly see what's wrong with that. does it lose the company money? no. because if i couldn't have jeong on an MNF body i wouldn't have got jeong at all!

 

Agreed. There are a LOT of companies where I like the heads, but not the bodies, and visa-versa. Both the apperance and price are a factor, although appearance takes priority.

 

How in the heck can taking a plastic doll head and sticking it on another plastic doll body be unethical? That's insane. These are glorified barbies we're talking about.

 

This is mentioned in the OP's post, but it's sort of buried in the middle of a paragraph, so I'd like to emphasize it.

There are quite a few sculptors who only produce heads, and some of them have been working since fairly early on in the existence of BJDs. Here are just some, the ones I happen to know about:

Alice in Labyrinth
Minawadou
Migidoll
Ninodoll
(Until recently) Ricky
RML

The logical consequence of this "debate" topic is that those sculptors are doing something unethical by choosing to produce heads alone, instead of full dolls. If making hybrid BJDs is unethical, then it follows that it's unethical for sculptors to make something that must inevitably lead to hybridization.

By logical extension, they should be stopped from doing this, or at least boycotted and denounced so that they come to understand and repent of their sins.

Does anyone really believe that?

Please tell me this topic is intended as satire.

Please?

 

@Cynthia in FlintHills The reason this was brought up was due to the closing posts of the now-locked Elitism thread which started to discuss the idea that hybrid dolls were "abominations" and perhaps unethical in some way.

...I'm having a hard time getting round the idea that hybrids are looked down on in some way at all. I'm going to have to have a long hard think about how to even tackle my thoughts regarding this before I try and make another post ^^;

 

This topic is one of the silliest I've seen in the debate forum yet. There is nothing that can be called unethical about sticking one company's doll head on another's body. It's just another part of customisation. You can dislike it all you want, but you can't call it unethical.

The fact of the matter is that we're talking about dolls. People can and will spend their money on whatever they want. If you're going to discriminate against people for that, then perhaps you'd better look at your own priorities, because thats pretty judgmental, petty and elitist.

This post wasn't directed at you OP, I was just pretty shocked at some of the comments I read in the other thread, and I think the fact that this topic even exists is pretty disgusting.

 

I see no problem. My Kiss has a wonderfully masculine, strong body... that doesn't suit the girly man he's meant to be. He's going to get a new body. He'll be a hybrid, because his body is plain wrong. It's like painting a new face on them, it's just making the doll right.

 

I can't think of anything more intelligent to say than, 'lol wat'.

 

While i don't find hybrids unethical, i'm worried about how the aformentioned elitists would feel about certain hybrids. I understand fully that some companies only produce heads for the purpose of hybrids, and i dont see why anyone would have a problem with one of those heads on any body at all, but i'm more personally worried about my own hyrbid girl.
Cynthia in flinthills: I think what is being pointed out isnt necessarially those sorts of hybrids, but more like having a hybrid of a head from one company who produces and offers their own bodies on a different companies body.

For example, my hybrid is a volks school b on a luts senior delf body. I chose the hybrid cause i really dont like volks bodies, and i'm generally not a volks fan but i love this head and she needed a body. Cost-wise, it wasnt much different, less than a hundred, i think. I just like the general look of the sdf girl body better than volks. Plus i'm a sucker for double joints. The match was perfect, and the head fit, and i love the body, so it was a perfect choice for me. (if the head fits, wear it? ^^;; )

My concern--and i hope i'm not overstepping the topic or anything, but i do feel its quite related--is what'll happen if i take her somewhere. Meets aren't a problem for me, everyone in my area is really nice and awesome, and there are hybrids abound, but what if i wanted to go to another dolpa? Its at least fairly understandable if the company is a little bit off with me bringing her in, but what about the other dolpa-goers in that case? I'm probably paranoid--i hope i'm being paranoid--but i just feel like if i took her in i'd get people telling me i had no right to be there or something because im disgracing the company or something by having a hybrid. I don't even want to know what it'd be like to explain to one of the actual volks people why she's on a different body ^^;; I just don't think thats quite fair, y'know?

i hope this wasnt too rambly ^^;;

 

*Runs away from thread with his hybrids*

Originally Posted by usagi665
You don't have to be opposed to the aesthetics of a hybrid, you can dislike it purely on "ethical" grounds. Maybe there are some that are visually appealing because they're owned by a good artist, but that doesn't mean you agree with what they did in the first place.

It's like saying you can't hate a fake Chanel bag just because it looks nice.

 

I'm all 'lol' at this thread at the moment....

Yet at the same time I would like to go to a dolpa with my School C, who is on a Dollmore boy body. Not cause I can't afford a volks body (I paid $400 for the fucking head D: ) but because It wasn't right for his character... Volks doesn't do slim. But it annoys me to know I wouldn't be able to go to a dolpa cause he is on another body.

Yeah, I love hybrids, I have 3 dolls that will be hybrids, my Elijah (no body to buy with) and my Miho (again the same) and my SchC.

But hey if people want to be close minded bigots then let them. No skin off my back D:

 

You'd be surprised, I think I remember hearing that Hypermaniac used to refuse to sell again to anyone that sold on their dolls? But in the current market especially, there are so many up and coming companies that are as obliging as possible in order to get a hold on sales, that if any established companies were being a bit.. divaish, they've probably rethought things by now.

I think, as the OP suggested, that rather than being a question of ethics it's more about the companies 'feelings' or whether you're treading on their toes, and that's really up to the company. On the one hand, you have companies like AOD who actively try to find out what resins their dolls match up with and offer several different resin tones because their dolls are so popular as hybrids, and most companies offer heads and bodies seperately by now, which presumably is for the convenience of people looking to make hybrids.

I think it'd be a bit overly sensitive if any doll manufacturer was hurt that people wanted to buy part but not all of their doll. I mean, you can't please everyone, and their sales will be higher if they can sell a doll to one person, a body to another, etc, than if they flat out refuse to sell anything except a full doll.

 

Was that from the other thread? Daaaamn. No, it's really not like saying you can't hate a fake designer bag because it looks nice, it's like saying you can't hate someone for wearing a bag from one designer and shoes from another! Hybrids are a totally different thing from knock-offs of someone elses work. They're parts from two legitimate companies that each worked hard on creating something beautiful and unique. And maybe another argument that could be made for hybrids is that Company A put more effort into their heads and Company B into their body sculpt, so by making a hybrid you're showing off the best aspects of both companies.

 

I do it all the time with my OTs, one guy just for a hair color only one company makes, others are because I put different head sculpts on a body I like. 2 companies make nice bods but boring heads. If I owned a company and people did it I'd be happy I was selling the parts they were using then I'd look in to why and try to come out with a product to fix it.

One of my hybrids was bought at the Volks store in LA, the staff was rather interested in the head and happy I had chosen 'the best' for his body. Not needing a head I had more money for doll shoes.

 

Why? If people are that petty, why give them a second thought?

At the end of the day, dolls are products. I paid (Y) company for (X) doll head: therefore, the head is now my property. I can do what I like with it. If the company doesn't like it, I'm going to roll my eyes. Would they have preferred it if I hadn't purchased one of their products at all, just because I didn't like their body sculpts?

In a lot of businesses, if a customer doesn't want to buy a product, it makes good sense to find out why, rather than act snotty towards the customer because they don't appreciate your speshul artwork. For the love of Jimbob, not everyone is going to like the same things.

Myself, I have my own preferences 1/3-scale regarding bodies:
It has to be adult-looking and fairly realistic.
It has to pose well and/or be double-jointed.
It has to be easily available, and come from a company I trust.
It has to have a competitive price. (No more than $400 for the body by itself, at most.) There has only ever been one doll I've been willing to spend more than $600 on (Feeple Ashley... alright, maybe Cali, too. And Iplehouse Akando. Okay, when I said one, I lied.), and that's because their bodies seem to be engineered really well.

If a company's bodies doesn't fit my preferences, then that's just tough. No-one's entitled to my money.

 

Click the blue thingy next to the username D: It'll take you back to the post lul...

I find it's a pretty bad comparison myself... I would say it's like like using another brand's shoulder strap and stitching it onto a chanel bag... You just really altering pieces and mixing parts to come up with a pleasing, unique product :3

 

As for bringing non-volks dolls to a Dollpa.. I don't think it has anything to do with them believing hybrids are less than other dolls. Dollpa is their sales-party, they use it to sell their own dolls. I wouldn't like it if someone brought stuff from a competing company to my shop. I can imagine Volks feels the same.

But saying 'hybrids are abominations and I can't bear to look at them', that's just silly. It's plastic. Get over it. There are more important things in life to worry about.

 

When I hear 'ethics' I think of the moral debate of right and wrong between people, other living things, perhaps even business models.

Not playing with post-consumer plastic toys.

 

It's a bit frustrating to see some folks purposefully misinterpreting the original intent positied. The member pretty clearly states that "ethical" isn't the right word -

Perhaps the "debate" could focus on the acceptability others feel towards "frankendollied" dolls? Obviously, ateliers that only produce heads are doing so with the conviction that abjd collectors are customizers who will match the head with an available body. And most companies sell dolls in pieces. When I ordered my Dollstown Elysia head and a 15boy body, Dollstown shipped me my beautiful boy as a complete doll - head attached! So that atelier is presumably perfectly at peace with the idea that collectors are going to head swap.

 

I have a suspicion that the "hybrids are abominations" sentiment is coming from the same people who think that modifying a doll in any permanent way is wrong. It's not part of the artist's divine vision, so we should all just leave well enough alone.

To which I say, as an artist: bullocks! Once somebody buys something, it's their own business how they treat it. And yes, the artist has the right to be horrified by what people do with their work, although worrying about such things seems like needless effort to me. What they don't have is the right to say, "No, you can't do that. Change it back this instant!" Well, I guess they could say it, if they really wanted to. Since they're not gods or kings, I don't expect that it would get them very far, though.

I get the feeling that in the doll fandom (now we'll have people coming out of the woodwork to protest that it's a fandom, I bet), artists are sometimes treated with an absurd level of adoration and worship. And yes, they make beautiful things, and we should appreciate them, absolutely. But I find the idea that one artist's vision is the only valid interpretation for your character to be more than a little silly.

I think I went off on a tangent, as usual

 

The idea of BJDs was to be able to customise them.
People who seriously care about a doll having a less elite/pure/sunshinecomingoutitsbutt body or head or legs or hands or whatever and then will go out of their way to tell this to someone who has a hybrid doll have too little happening in their lives and are probably just looking for conflict. Same with any percieved elitist/rude/mean/otherwise unacceptable comment directed to a person for their choice in doll.

 

Hybrids can often occur as a result of someone buying a Minimee head and then having to find and purchase a suitable body to fit the head, which often won't be a D.I.M (who are one of the makers of Minimee's) girl or boy body depending.

 

I am all for Hybrids. Sometimes hybrid dolls are even nicer than company's dolls. Yay for creativity. That's what I love about BJDs! ~Gus

 

I know I wasn't purposely misinterpreting the OPs intent, I was commenting on the use of the word 'ethics' that I've seen elsewhere, as was the OP.

Sorry if it came across that way.

 

Maybe an interesting path to pursue in this discussion might be the idea of attraction/repulsion when it comes to hybrids. They do seem to evoke knee-jerk reactions from some people, both positive and negative.

If you are attracted to them, what attracts you? If the opposite, what repulses you? Any insights as to why? Do people who feel one way or the other fall into more general categories of doll keeping (example: Mint In Box vs. Extreme Modding)?

Just a thought.

 

I can't see any issues with hybrids what so ever. These dolls are meant to be customized, and this is one more way to do that. I suppose a company could prefer to see it's heads on it's own bodies, but really, it's still saying company X makes great heads and company Y makes great bodies! So I really don't see any kind of insult there. There are many many dolls from different companies out on the market right now, and many people have dolls from a variety of different places anyway.

Also, once I buy a doll (or doll part in this case), it belongs to me and it is up to me what I want to do with it. Not up to any other collector who might have a problem or company who might have a problem (though with a few exceptions, there are many companies that offer parts separately anyway). The only important things for me is that I love the doll, and that I have done my best to make him/her into the vision that I had for that character. If that means putting a head on a different body, then so be it. I see no ethical issue about it, and aesthetics are very much in the eye of the beholder.

As others have also pointed out, there are some artists who only sell heads. My Ninodolls would still be disembodied heads I hadn't been able to hybridize them.

 

Essentially my point as well.

 

I for one love Hybrids, don't have any yet, but DD is working on a couple to save her money as well as get the look she wants. Me I would love for my DT Rhea to get a body that will allow more clothes choices as well as make her a little more unique. And with the new bodies and dolls coming out left and right who knows what I might want to try out. I think it is fine as long as the results is what owner wants, who cares what anyone else thinks.

 

If I could find a nice sexy body that I could put my NS Volks MSD head on I would SO FAST.
Also I see nothing in the universe that could be 'unethical' about switching doll bodies around.

 

I think the term *ethical* is too loaded to use in the context of the bjd hobby outside of ripping off and selling designs of any kind...so I'll just place that to the side and ignore it.

The Volks issue has been well addressed and I agree ~ it's common sense and only polite to not bring outside BJD products when attending a manufacturers event. Nothing elitist about that.

What we really have is an interesting intersection of BJD expectations:

Old school Group ~ people who like to get their hands dirty and customize their dolls from the ground up or mix n match to tweak their resins to perfection.

Newbie Group A ~ grateful for finished dolls and are willing to risk learning to customize to perfection

Newbie Group B ~ grateful for finished dolls because they just love to dress them an play with them but don't really want to get their hands too dirty

Doll collectors ~ several subgroups here, but it includes those who see the purchased doll as perfect in every way, and the original designers vision should never be tampered with.

An element in the latter group will never embrace hybridization (not neccessarily doing it themselves but accepting it's legitimacy), which is their loss for they are missing out on what raises these dolls above the rest.

 

Okay first of all, if you think is a topic is silly then don't bother replying since you clearly will have nothing useful to say. It means you're not taking this debate seriously, you're one stop away from posting a cat picture.

The word "ethics" was brought up more for lack of a better term, but on some level it does fit. You can read in many threads about people complaining about some company's bodies not being detailed enough for their taste, or that the jointing system is amateurish, or that the resin is too shiny without being MSCed. This means that companies who go to the trouble of actually making bodies that do turn out to be not so great are looked down upon whereas head-only sculptors never have to deal with that. They get praised for their pretty head, you buy a SD body since they always pick Volks' skin tones to mimic, and it's done.

These head only sculptors just use more talented artists as a stepping stone and it's a slap in the face to the artists who developed those bodies. And no, it's not flattering for someone to want to use your art to complement theirs, it means you get paid less money.

 

I don't think hybrids are any better or worse than non-hybrids. They're all just dolls.

'Hybridization' takes place in just about every customizable collectibles hobby. You'll always have people willing to take a chance and mix parts from box A with a kit from box B. As for manufacturers being concerned about losing sales, I think there are two elements to consider.

First, if they're producing a good doll body, even if a few people are choosing not to use it, others will be. Maybe someone wants to put a Dollmore head on a DoT body - but someone else might be just as likely to put a k-doll head on a dollmore body further down the road. Hybridization benefits companies with good doll bodies.
Second, if a company is producing a poor doll body (imo, an example of this would be the old DIM body), then hybridization is a good motivation to try and come up with a more functional body. If you're losing sales to people hybridizing your doll, it might be time to re-think your sculpts. We as the consumer are then more likely to have a broader range of body sculpts to choose from.
Competition is good, even with BJDs. I don't see anything wrong with hybridizing a doll whose original body either doesn't fit your own character image, or simply doesn't hold up to your standards.

Usagi, I'm sorry, I'm not going to pay a company for a terrible body sculpt, 'artistic' or not. They can either work on a better body sculpt or take the loss. It's like, I'm not going to buy a poorly-done painting just because it's 'art'.
And to insinuate that artists who sculpt heads only are 'stepping' on bigger companies is simply absurd. Artists making head sculpts are usually one-person operations who may not have the time or resources to develop a body, and even then it's a lot of money to spend on a project that's not a sure thing.

 

Now this is a fascinating argument! So, are you saying, essentially, that head-only sculptors are opportunists and that therein lies the ethical dilemma??? I could be persuaded to accept that - if I thought that the intent was there....and on that score, I'm not convinced. Certainly, it's far far easier and less expensive and time-consuming to become an atelier that produces ONLY heads - but is that being done with the intention of making a fast, easy buck? Or because part and parcel of the dollery is hybridization?

I do not agree, however, with your statement that most hybrids are done with Volks bodies - that seems really aggressive a stance. A quick peek into the BJD Picture Request subforum will show hundreds of threads in which collectors are looking for resin/proportion matches with nearly every company out there.

 

I think it's great that people can make a doll from the head they like the most put on the body they like the most if they wish. ^_^ I do believe that that's also the reason why most companies sell their dolls both assembled and in optional parts.

 

What a sweeping generalization

Head-only sculptors aren't exactly talentless! Have you actually seen Migidoll's heads? Perhaps an artist prefers to make heads because they find that doing so is more interesting and challenging for them?

Who do you think gets paid less money in the long run? Seriously, in this hobby what goes around comes around. Even if the body is sold by itself direct from the company, or arrives in a pre-arranged split, or a customer buys a full doll and swaps out the heads, the original company profits just as much as ever. Someone will always want their heads, someone else will always want the bodies - have you really seen the whole community outright reject a series of heads from one company, but gush over their bodies? I haven't. We don't agree enough on aesthetics to uniformly decide that one company's heads aren't worth the resin they're made of...so who is going to lose out?

 

So wait... if someone buys a Volks body only because they need a body for their floating head, and otherwise would have NEVER bought a Volks body... Volks is getting paid less money by selling a body they would have otherwise not sold?

I see a gap in that logic. Seems to me like Volks would be making more money by having people who don't necessarily like their headsculpts, but do like their bodies, go out and buy their bodies to use with other heads?

ETA for Clarity:

For example, I do not like any Volks heads. I would never buy an entire Volks doll for my collection, ever. I just don't like Volks heads! But maybe I like the head from XYZ company, and I either (a) don't like their body, or (b) XYZ company doesn't make bodies. So I buy my head from XYZ, and then I go out and buy a Volks doll for the body! Suddenly Volks has made a sale they would have NEVER made otherwise. Volks is getting MORE money from this deal, because this is the ONLY way I would have bought a doll from Volks. I don't see how that's a bad thing?

 

What on *earth* difference does it make who puts which part with what other part? People have different tastes in builds, jointing, faces, what have you. Maybe you really want a particular face but can't swing the price for the full doll at the time. Whatever reason it is, it's a good reason as long as the results are something you enjoy. At some point the arguments devolve into the same gray area as any other "aesthetics" kind of discussion -- in which there comes a point at which no amount of discussion will be able to bridge the gap between "I like this" and "I don't like that."

Maybe... I'm missing the point of people's objections. ? Stranger things have happened...


Oh, and I need to add the impression that some doll makers obviously do heads because they have superb talent in that area and take joy in sculpting beautiful heads. Maybe feet or buns don't interest said sculptor. Some people can't draw hands but can draw faces. Why work on something you don't like? And by the same token...if heads-alone companies bug people... don't buy them?

 

You're making a statement about the intentions of a broad group of people. What evidence do you have to support this viewpoint?

By that logic, you should only buy eyes, wigs, faceups and clothing from the same company that produced your doll.

 

With regards to Alice in Labyrinth, who currently only cast heads (although I seem to remember a rumour they were going to begin making bodies...?) it states on their page that they offer these heads to go on various bodies and can be either gender. So...

...Instead of seeing the companies who create heads only as opportunists, wouldn't it be more productive to see them as creative nodes in an already overwhelmingly creative hobby, keen and excited to see what their customers would like to do with their works of art...?

My opinion in most forms of visual media -- here including ABJDs -- is that the creators are only half of the final product. The consumers are the ones who complete the product by "owning" it in their individual way, whatever that may be. They are the ones who help to complete the vision of the artist. What is a film or a comic book without an audience? Etc.

It allows for expansion and further creativity on behalf of the original artists. Perhaps these head-only sculptors would not have had the idea to produce just heads if they had not seen what fans and hobbyists were doing themselves ... not simply to make some quick money, but to encourage the creativity and allow a hobby to grow in a new and different way...?

 

Doll companies are still a business out to make money and they're still getting money in the end. If it was solely about the artistic merit, they wouldn't be a big-money business manufacturing hundreds to thousands of the same items over and over with numerous customization options. The supplier cannot control what the consumer does with the end product. They can try, but it's futile. These companies also cannot control what their customers want or what their preferences are.

If I like a body from one company, but none of their heads, and a head from another and none of their bodies, why should I have to be forced with one or the other? Should I be worried about their feelings being hurt? Should I not be allowed to participate in this hobby because I have a hybrid? When art meets business, lines blur because you can't have both. Once your product leaves your hands, it's no longer under your control. Start forcing the hands of your customers outside your contained business world and into their homes, you lose business.

Also, only making heads doesn't mean that the artist is 'less talented'. To me that's like saying a person who makes only hats or shoes is less talented than someone who makes a whole outfit. No, they're different things and they compliment each other. I'm not going to wear the same brand of something head to toe simply because the company would prefer it.

 

I paid $250 for both of my migidoll heads and that's not factoring in the shipping.
I'll pay $895 for the bodies (not factoring shipping) $445 for Souldoll and $450 for a Latidoll.
When you include shipping that's over a thousand. So how in the world am I taking away money from the body sculptor and giving more to the head sculptor? In fact why do companies even sell their bodies separately?

I for one love my hybrids and worked extremely hard to obtain them and am now working just as hard to get them the perfect bodies. I spent months on end searching through countless threads and sites looking for the perfect resin match. I am not spending less I am infact spending more. I have no clue why anyone would look down on hybrids. Some companies make beautiful heads and the bodies they come with are just bleh while it could be vise verse on other sites. The world of bjd is all about customization and if I find a beautiful sculpt but dislike the body I don't care how people or the company feel about it I am going to find the perfect body and I won't settle for less.

I just want to start a poll and see how many people here on DoA actually own hybrids because we make up a darn good percentage of the population here.

My final word is this: In the long run I don’t give a rat’s butt as to your opinions or thoughts on this matter, if you want to be so narrow-minded and want to stay up there on your high-horse that’s cool, but I don’t want to have anything to do with you.

 

where do i even begin.

peoples opinions that the topic is silly shouldn't bear to much ground if they should reply. their point that it's a silly topic and why it's a silly topic is just as valid.

and you can like part of a doll without likeing the whole thing. i like a company's heads, but hate their bodies or vice versa so i shouldn't buy from them period? that to me is beyond flawed logic. and then the company looses out on a sale completely.

and as a person sculpting just a head hands and feet to purchase a body for, i can a sure you no where in my thought process did Volks cross my mind. i despise their bodies and i find most of their faces lacking. i'm making and planned my whole sculpt around being able to fit a bobobie body. i'm making alot of other dolls and scuplting the whole doll, however for that particular doll i really wanted that body cause it matched what i wanted it for. i'm even going to have bobobie cast my head. so i highly doubt i'm th eonly one who doesn't choose volks to match.

i don't feel it's stealing from anyone anything. if it wasnt' for hybrids, i wouldn't have bought from half the companys that i have because i don't like certian things or they don't fit my characters. and you can be a great sculptor and only have room in your apartment for so many molds, so doing just heads seems like a very wise thing to me.

and personaly from the whole attitude in your post, i smell high horse. insulting someone who just sculpts heads when you don't know the reason behind it is beyond rude. and deeming them a lesser artist because of it. is scoff worthy. i'd love to see anyone with this attitude try to scuplt anything, see which is more time consuming and expensive, sculpting a head or a whole doll and see what you get.

 

I'd think if it does not work for you, you're gonna search for something better.
After seeing some hybrids, I concluded that it's a play on creativity; you imagine the perfect doll and want "only the best" when it comes to decals/eyes, wigs, option parts, etc. It's impressive that people are able to pull off some hybrids. So for a company to say that they don't want a specific head on other company's bodies is kinda...weird. I think it'd be good marketing. <u<

 

I like companies that encourage the creativeness in the hobby and offer options. Or at the very least, recognize that people are going to split things apart. Some companies could make a lot more money...I'm thinking Soom could make major bank just selling vega and deneb heads separately. But, at least Soom lets you choose to not get the outfits, ect, in their limiteds, recognizing that their vision is not the /only/vision for the LE mold.

I think hybrids are difficult to pull off resin matches, but successful ones are great. I generally prefer the bodies that are from thesame company as my head, but I have three dolls that are hybrids of different companies, and three that are on bodies they did not come with, but from within the same company.

My reasons for the 3 within the company was a desire to make the dolls male, for two, and taller for the third.

My reasons for the different company hybrids were a combo of cost, height and posability.

Nothing wrong with it...

 

Maybe it's because I'm pretty new to this, but I don't get why anyone (company or other collectors) would care whether people create hybrids or not. In the (lots) of looking around I've done lately it seems that some companies have absolutely amazing beautiful and well-sculpted bodies, and some have bodies that are less amazing. Some MUCH less amazing. While most companies have beautiful heads, they are all done in various styles. If one of the dolls I'm creating needs a certain look, and I find the perfect head, but the body is clunky and way too childlike for the character, I'm going somewhere else for the body.

I also don't think head-only sculptors are capitalizing on others abilities - they are actually probably bringing the companies that make great bodies more business. There's no laziness in sculpting just heads - bodies aren't just artistic, there's a LOT of engineering involved to make them move and work correctly, while a head IS more purely artistic with no moving parts. I would bet that the bigger companies have artists who specialize in each. Forcing head-sculpt specialists to create bodies also might lead to just as many hybrids, if their bodies don't measure up to what's already out there.

 

Nope, it's not because you're new. I've been doing this for about 2 1/2 years now and feel exactly the same way.

 

Honestly until I started poking around in the debate section I had no idea that people were getting their panties in a twist over hybrids. That just seems silly to me. But once again, as I stated in another debate thread for me this is a hobby that revolves around having fun and enjoying my dolls. If person A doesn't think person B should enjoy their dolls unless they're 100% pure from the company then that's person A's problem. And maybe person A should take a step back from the "srs bsns" of dolls and re-evaluate why their happiness is more important than everyone else's.

Just my thoughts on the matter.

 

I... just don't get this. Why in the world would:

Person A care that Person B has a hybrid,
A hold B in contempt for making a hybrid doll,
B care that A has a grudge against them that they own a hybrid?

It's a doll. If B has a doll and is happy with it? Great! If A hates B for it... well, maybe A needs to rethink the hobby, as it is clearly just too intense.

As for myself? I have several hybrids. I appreciate my hybrids for the reasons that they are hybrids.

Example:

Kethlen, my tall elf boy is a Luts Juri A on a Bobobie body. I needed him to be tall and skinny, but not 70cm. Bobobie's boy body fit the description and matched resin. Ta-da. Hybrid = happiness.

Hanako, my steampunk girl, is a Luts Juri 05 on a Dollfie Dream 1 body. I needed her to be able to support the weight of corsetry, hooping, and holding brass and heavier objects, so hybrid she became.

And those are just two of many.

But seriously, how far does this bizarre line go? Do we count the El heads on girl bodies? Do we count the Lishe boys? Do we count the Volks Olivia boys, or the *gasp* changing of hands??? I may have put Angel Region hands on a Volks body because I liked the shape better. Or what if I put Soom feet on a Luts doll so my girl could stand in heels? Better yet, what about all the eyes and wigs? Do we really have to conform to putting Luts on Luts and Volks on Volks?

Pretty soon, it's mass chaos and we're back to Barbie dolls with painted eyes, vapid smiles and bent arms that you can't do anything with.

 

I'm gonna have to agree with the vast majority of everyone else that has posted and say that I don't think there is anything wrong with hybrids. I happen to prefer my dolls to have non-jointed torsos, and if I could find such a body that would fit my Shoyo proportionally and be a decent resin match, I'd have no problem hybridizing her. She's my doll and I'm going to do with her what I have to until I'm totally happy.

Of course, those that find hybrids to be an abomination are more then welcome to their opinion and I'm actually glad when they share it. It makes it that much easier for me to know who in this hobby to stay away from.

 

I don't like hybrids myself, because I want artistic integrity in what I buy, and a doll that is a hodgepodge of different parts just doesn't seem 'whole' to me... it's just a pile of parts strung together. No matter how much I want "Expensive Volks Head X", I'd never, NEVER put it on "Cheap Body Y" because it doesn't ring true. It's like cheating or copying; almost like owning a fake designer bag or something...

I do own a hybrid, however... but only because the company that made the head never made bodies (RML Japan) at all. It took me many expensive tries before I found a body that matches the resin 99.9% perfectly. I had to consider body size/style, and resin type/color/translucency. It was a major effort to find a match I could live with. I can't help but feel as if my hybrid doll is a sort of bastard entity though, but I loved this head so much that it was worth it to me, and I feel I did my best to create a piece that has as much integrity as possible under the circumstances.


Raven

 

I have a slight problem with hybridization; if it's done badly. But it's just a personal preference, and I don't really give a hoot if someone on the forums has one (I'd hardly notice, anyhow!)

But hybrids that really work can be a whole new world of wonder! Say, I want a doll, but the body it comes with doesn't suit my aesthetical tastes/isn't the right body build/doesn't pose well enough. Then there's another doll I'd like to own solely because of their awesomelistic body, but don't really find the heads to my liking, if I could combine the two it would be an absolute dream! *cough* I am actually in the process of trying to acquire the aforementioned doll, it will be my first hybrid, so I'll wait and see how much I'll actually like it.

But in the end, it's really up to the owner how they complete their dolls, I don't think it's really anyone else's business to bother with making a fuss over it. ^^;

 

Artistic integrity is in the eye of the beholder, I feel, especially in a hobby where the collectible in question is meant to be customized.

What's your opinion on non-company faceups and handmade clothing?

 

I must say that I agree with you, fully. =)

That said, I also love your avatar!

 

I think only those that don't really get to potential are hesitant to consider hybrids. It's what BJD's are all about...creating a doll like no other!

I have a Doll right now that Has a KayzKids head, Jollyplus torso and arms, B&G Legs, and Volks feet. Now getting the right resin match took me as more research and time as many people put into their first doll. But there was no perfect body for my girl. She not even finished yet, as I want Dollga hands for her...and probably will switch out her arms for something else

If you look, the possiblities are endless!

 

It may not be flattering in their eyes, but if someone doesn't want their work to be used in a way they do not like, they shouldn't sell it.
Besides, to sculpt a head you need to be just as talented as when you're sculpting a body. It's difficult for different reasons but for both you need skill, knowledge of anatomy, extensive practice and a good eye for aesthetics. Clay won't turn into a masterpiece by itself.