Twigling Doll Discussion ~ Part 2

twigling i was one who said that your mail was hacked cause i thinked that this was exactly what happened months ago, a tentative of hacking. Sorry if i gave the wrong infos, but i don't feel that is a huge mistake from my side.

Good to know about thin eyelids, imo it's a good thing cause i think that SA Ingenue especially has thin eyelids. Not an happy bunny about changing Pietà nose bridge: if i can voice my opinion mine would be no. I think that Pietà is a unique sculpt and changing the nose bridge to me would change her expression, more over i don't have any reference pictures, nor WIP..so if is not really necessary i ask you to do not change nothing in her, cause as Therealwalter said this is the mold i've chosen..and i love her as she is right now.

 

I would be for keeping the original Pieta head along the future one (with the 'amended' nose) on offer. I would be interested in seeing a Pieta with a different nose.

 

Thank you, Lilla

No, it's not a huge mistake, but I reserve the right to make a correction anyway


Regarding Pietás nose, please just wait. ***I*** don't even know what its gonna look like yet. I will not be offering two versions of Pietá in this preorder, there are already 8 heads on offer and I think that is enough. Maybe I will wait with the nose-changed one for another order, but first and foremost, lets see where the nose goes, you might like it.

 

Are we locked in on the head sculpt yet? Like, we can change our minds? And what are the 8 heads on offer?

 

twigling
Honestly i don't like indipendently a change in Pietà sculpt/mold: my feelings are why change something that is not broken? Hope it makes sense. I think also that i'm a little confused on what do you mean about Pietà nose bridge changes: do you mean that Pietà will not be changed in this preorder, or that will be changed and this new sculpt will be the definitive one from now on?
I'm would be fine with that only if i have the chance to choose between Pietà actual sculpt and the other one with nose bridge altered, but if the change in Pietà sculpt means that i would get the altered Pietà sculpt then no, i rather prefer to have Pietà with no modifications at her nose.

Regarding the mail i was just trying to share some info, infact i also suggested to use as contact form your official facebook as well.

 

What if you offer original Pietà sculpt for this pre-order and than offer the Pietà updated sculpt for the next pre-orders?Just saying...

 

Hey guys!! I've been admiring Twigling's lovely creations for many years now, silently from afar, until I rediscovered her Flickr and saw her new molds and chest piece!! It's the final trigger for me to put one of her creations on my list of dolls to wish for, and hopefully preorder at some time soon!! Female Elf is the head in question, and she's just perfect and lovely in every way! I have a feeling I'll be lurking here for the next few months while I get all my ducks in a row--I can't wait!!

 

Shadeling Sanguine maybe i'm not adding some new infos but at the moment Twigling is making a long layway, i think that you could still join if you could pay a deposit, just saying in case you wish to jump on the wagon of the long layway

 

[MENTION=26610]$abbatha[/MENTION] - I did see that, but as I have a trip coming up, I can't join just yet. ; ~ ; But thank you for pointing it out!! I'm hoping to return home from my trip in August with enough for a deposit, if the preorder is still open. Fingers crossed!!

 

Not until I send out the more detailed form, and we place the order with the factory. The 8 sculpts are listed here.

This is maybe what I will do. Assume Pietá will still be as she originally was and I will name the variant something else, if I even release her. When I finish work on the variant I will decide if I even show her for the time being, or leave her unseen so as not to confuse in the current preorder.

 

Shadeling Sanguine i will keep my finger crossed that you could join at very least!
Wow that's great Twigling so we can still change our minds about mold and resin color?It's great really!

 

Thank you. I have my heart set on getting Pieta but might add one of the new heads too. Will see when they are totally set and finished.

 

You know what people? Khalo is growing on me..the lips are awesome

 

Should we email you [MENTION=238]twigling[/MENTION] when we decide what we want to order? Like i chose the head i want at deposit time but have decided on the body options and skin and such. Or should we wait for an email?

 

Skittzlez2 i guess that when you're ready you need to message to Twigling and let her know your preferences in matter of body type, bust size, skin resin color, head mold.
I guess that sooner all of us need to decided what body and which sculpt cause we're at half of layway plan..basicly i've almost chosen which body, which head, i just wait to see the newer sculpts and the resin sample to voice my preferences, hope it helps.

 

For now, just place an order if you haven't already. When I can post pictures of the finished masters (before sending them to the factory), I will send out a form asking you to lock in which parts and colours etc you want. For now and until we send order to factory, you can still change your mind about what you want.

Here are some WIP pics of Pietá's new (maybe) nose: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.982814461752708.1073741845.242015645832597&type=3 There is a link on that page to the original as well, so you can compare.

And I have uploaded the resin samples here: https://www.facebook.com/vrouwkijn/posts/982802428420578

 

I love the new pieta and the teal...
Good that she will be released later I wouldn't know which one to choose between her and Kalho...

if you change your mind I would have to adopt two of your dolls this preorder...

 

Love, love LOVE Pietá's new nose!! And the vivid resin is gorgeous!
Somehow when I wasn't paying attention I got the idea of putting my floating BW Siean head on a TL3 body so she can join my other elves Verity and Nemesis. Verity is on the small bust TL3 body and she poses like a dream!

 

I agree--I wasn't sure how to feel about a new nose, but I actually like it a lot now that I see it! The resin colors are great as well! Is vivid considered one of the darker colors that requires extra payment? It won't affect my choice but I'm curious.

 

Wow. I really love the new Pietá. And I thought she was quite lovely to begin with! The teal is neat!

 

The new Pietá is absolutely stunning, I love the revision to the nose. And the resin colors are gorgeous. Is the tan the same as the tan used for the Ingenieuse/Elf Ingenue?

 

I'm not sold to the new Pietà, i'm fine with the changes but i still prefer to original sculpt, the new nose changes her easthetic and i rather prefer to have her as originally was sculpted.

 

The new Pietá is indeed interesting, but definitely the original mold is pretty unique and i like it the best.
Oh resin colors are great,i'm superhappy to have chosen vivid color, i love it!

 

I'm in love with the teal color ! It's so beautiful and unique !
I still have not join (my professional situation is too unpredictable !) but I hope to be able to join before the pre-order !!! keep fingers crossed !

But, I'm in love with the female elf ! and Gamine ! and the new torso !!!
I''ve already a lot of Twiglings (Ingénue, Ingénieuse tan, Pièta rose skin, Eloy) and seems that one more is fighting to come home too ! Must be crazy !!!!

 

Oh now i'm curious, which mold among the new offered for the long layaway program is growing on you?
I love teal color as well!

 

I still prefer the original Pieta for the reason that the low nose bridge works for the ethnicities I want it to represent. Nose structure is different in different ethnic groups as they evolved to adapt to their environmental conditions. Subsaharan Africa and Southeast Asia have extreme high temperature areas of climate where a low nose bridge and wider nostril openings serve to allow heat to escape from the head whereas more northern colder climates of Europe and Asia e.g. China nose bridges became higher to conserve heat and moisture.

The way I see her, Pieta in a tan skin could easily be from Thailand, Laos, Cambodia. And Pieta in darker brown could be from somewhere in Africa. She can be in lighter skin and be from other places too but would fall into a more exotic look. Obviously there is greater variation within different groups than there is between groups and many Thai for instance do have a higher nose. But it is the extremity of character that appeals to me in this sculpt as there are way more dolls that do not show these traits which makes her so unique.

In the skull, the nose area, eye orbits, and brow ridges typically show significant racial differences. The eye orbits of Blacks tend to be of a more rectangular shape. Eye orbits of Whites are typically more angular, and eye orbits of Asians and American Indians more rounded. Whites typically have heavy brow ridges; Asians and Blacks have small brow ridges. Australian Aborigines and Aboriginal Papuans have heavy and prominent brow ridges.
There are five distinguishing characteristics of the nose area of the skull. The root is the uppermost part of the nose, where the nasals connect to the frontal bone above. The bridge is the structure formed by the nasal bones, extending downward from the root. The spine is a bone projection at the midline bottom of the nasal opening and the front of the upper jaw bones (anterior maxillae). The nasal opening is the aperture at the front center of the skull below the eye orbits, below the bridge and above the spine and lower border. The lower border is the area at the bottom of the nasal opening, to the sides of the midline.
[TABLE="width: 990"]
[TR="bgcolor: #CCFFFF"]
[TD="colspan: 6, align: center"]Comparison of Nasal Area Bone Characteristics[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: #CCFFFF"]
[TD="width: 165, align: center"]Race[/TD]
[TD="width: 165, align: center"]Root[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Bridge[/TD]
[TD="width: 140, align: center"]Spine[/TD]
[TD="width: 165, align: center"]Nasal Opening[/TD]
[TD="width: 165, align: center"]Lower Border[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]Black[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Low, rounded[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Low[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Small[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Wide[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Guttered[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]White[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]High, narrow[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]High[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Pronounced[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Narrow[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Sill, sharp[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]Asian[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Low, ridged[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Low[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Small[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Medium[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Flat, sharp[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

Thanks for this Therealwalter, is this from a forensics paper?

EDIT: I thank you again, I've been thinking trying my hand at clay sculpting a head and this is going to help if I want to mix the features (If I can get THAT good).

 

When I look at the original Pietá nose, I see this: http://capello.nu/wp-content/uploads/lilla-my.jpg. To the question of "why change what isn't broken?" I guess, while not broken I see it as flawed, unfinished, not well executed and thinking that I can do a better job. Also my tastes may have changed, maybe after starting at these sculpts for so long I am increasingly able to put my finger on what is "off" about them in my own opinion, and set about fixing it. In Pietá's case, I have a bit more work to do on her, and need to count over how many people actually want Pietá and see which version they prefer. I suppose the most fair thing is to stick with the original for this preorder, which is most "as advertised". The second most fair thing would be a vote, but not sure about that yet. Maybe I will keep working on new-Pietá and change her eyes and open her mouth a bit, admittedly I am a bit taken by Splendid Angharad from Mad Max: Fury Road and see some of her in Pietá.

Skimo, if they can share body, there is no reason you couldn't order more than one head.

Kiya, the tan is more or less the same but I imagine it could vary as any factory colour batch would be prone to.

Walter, I would like to see some photos of the type of ethnicity you are trying to emulate with Pietá as the text isn't very "visual" for me in that sense.

Andarton, as I understood it, the Vivid colour falls alongside the tan in terms of price bracket.

 

I wish I could have flying heads sharing bodies, but I am not sure I can stand it in the long run and not regret not getting other bodies afterwards...and I love both the new and older torso and the double bust stand... I love the teal and I am tempted by tan, but of course I wished it was between vivid and tan or a darker tan...

I have to admit I love the new version of Pieta, I had doubts about the old one because on profile her mouth looked too "forward" compared to the rest of her face in my eyes.
Many people like open mouth sculpts, but sadly I am not one of them...

A Pieta preorder with the choice of differents expressions/nose shape could be an idea if you want to let this sculpt evolve to something new... and still let people have the choice...

 

I originally joined the long preorder for Pietá, but I really, really like the new nose better (but I'm not a fan of open mouths on dolls at all) and none of the other sculpts on offer would work for the character I have in mind, so now I'm just conflicted and stuck.

 

Just kill me now, please. No matter what I do or even suggest, there is somebody who won't be happy. Talk about feeling conflicted and stuck... Not only can I not please everyone, possible I cannot please anyone.

 

May I send you a virtual hug?

Sorry if anything I said has participated in your dilemna...

The more the choices the harder it gets for everyone...

I guess sculpting freely is much more enjoyable than taking care of the bjd customers , sorry about that....

 

I do not know if this suggestion would help but I believe offering a V1 Peita and V2 might be the best solution? This way people who wanted original Peita may get her and those who like the new version can opt for her. It is really hard to please everyone especially when your business/livelyhood is based on keeping customers happy with what they buy!

It may turn out that the new version of Peita ends up being her own sculpt in all rights. As we've seen with other doll companies different versions of the same sculpt are not at all uncommon! Dollshe's Hound had 3 different versions : ) even if it means you discontinue the original Peita after this pre-order I can see this solution might be one way to keep everyone happy.

 

I second [MENTION=23190]Krowbar[/MENTION]'s Pieta v1 and v2 suggestion. IMO it’s awesome you’re willing to let us have so much input. Thank you and for sharing your work with us!!

 

Pieta was on my wishlist already, but with the new nose she had moved up nearer the top of the list. If she had an open mouth I probably wouldn't be able to resist anymore! X3

 

[/URL]Surgically altered ethnic nose shape by Walter Eskildsen, on Flickr[/IMG]

I had trouble finding a picture to demonstrate the ethnic features I was mentioning. There is a lady at my work who is a perfect example but it would be rude of me to take her picture.
One of the effects of globalization is that standards of beauty that are culturally defined become less regional and more generalized to what the popular media feeds us. The result is that women feel that they need to emulate a standard of appearance that is not necessarily possible with their natural features. The above photo is from a plastic surgery site showing before and after pictures of what the surgeon was calling "feminization" but really what it does is remove the natural ethnic features of the low nasal bridge and wide nares in favor of the more conventional beauty. Similar surgical modifications are being offered to shave down the raised hump of the "Jewish" aquiline nose, to give a double eyelid in place of the natural epicanthic fold of Asian eyes, to raise the flat cheekbones, etc. If you are saying to yourself "but the one on the right does look more beautiful" you are not alone. The conventions of beauty are becoming defined by the types of faces we see in the Miss Universe Pageant! My point is that the more extreme forms of ethnic features can still be beautiful as well without conforming to global norms which is why I love the original Pieta.

Since there are already 8 sculpts on offer, maybe the solution is to offer V1 and V2 Pieta or whatever you want to call the "improved" version and have 9 sculpts to choose from if I am in the minority in still wanting the original. Or does there need to be a certain number of each before they are financially feasible to have casted?

And don't feel bad if you cannot please everybody. Nobody can do that.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/476/18316101650_9608386b23_z.jpg

An example of aboriginal woman from the Philipines who is beautiful in her own way.

 

Therealwalter seems that me and you only likes the original Pietà sculpt, now to give to this a short cut: i would be truely unhappy *using a very polite term here* if i have to keep Pietà V2, honestly.
To me she is perfect as it is, also offering one last pre-order with original sculpt would be fair for me. No one can be pleased, agree. Someone will be unhappy, agree. Offering 9 sculpts would be the best choice but i also agree that would be too much for this long layway.
I also understand about changes in tastes finish or retouch and unfinished works, fine with that. But hey as already claimed in the very first row of this post heck i would be truely unhappy to see Pietà changed into a different version without having the chance to chose or own the original Pietà. Peace.

 

I love your dolls. I think every face you've sculpted is striking and amazing. Please don't take me waffling out loud (so to speak) with anything less than a shaker full of salt. Really, it's not like I'd actually be unhappy about buying any of your dolls.
So what if a few people don't like something? There will be just as many (maybe more) who do

 

Well, I love the new nose. I liked the old version, but I love the new girl.

 

@twigling

I know I've said this before, and I will say it again: Create your dolls. They are amazing. Don't worry about making people happy, because people will like them. Your work is stunning and the quality of it speaks for itself. Don't doubt it. Just do what feels right to you.

I actually mentioned this situation to my partner, and he said that this conflict you mention is why companies have a separation between public relations and their design teams. It allows the public relations personnel to say, "Yes, we'll take that to our designers," and then to go through the suggestions with the person heading the design team, and determine which suggestions are useful and which ones are just going to derail the project. And meanwhile, the design team is working, uninhibited. Because feedback is good, but too much feedback, or feedback during the design process, can actually be detrimental. It's also why many design projects use a "post-mortem" evaluation approach, where they don't look at customer feedback until after the design has been finalized and released, and then they gather the feedback and use it to improve future designs or new (updated) versions, rather than trying to take customer feedback into account during the design process itself. I explained to him that as a one-person operation, that kind of separation isn't really possible for you, but the post-mortem idea might be something to consider.

 

I hope you do not misunderstand. I am not saying that I dislike the new version or that there is something wrong with it. It is just that I love the old version which is what I thought I was buying when I signed up. So in my mind I already had this version visualized as a person.

 

My mood is even worse today. Honestly at 6 months, half way, of the long layway the head i chosen would be probably reshelled into a different sculpt that is not something i'm looking for.
Open eyes, open mouth/lips, bridge nose changed means to me a different mold..and i'm not just intersted into it. As Therealwalter said i'm not saying that Pietà V2 is nothing interesting, but i rather prefer the original sculpt.

I'm not criticizing the artistic views and needs of the the artist herself, let's make it clear..but heck in the middle of the layway out of the blue are popping out drastical changes to the mold i've chosen 6 months ago and honestly i don't feel to be happy..period.

 

Honestly i feel for those that's including $abbatha and Therealwalter that like Peità with her original mold, at very least have a choice with option it will be the best and fair thing possible.
Bottom line just those that will going to order Pietà should have a choice between the original mold and the new one with the changes of nose bridge, mouth open and eyes open too, i think that nobody here is saying that new Pietà sculpt isn't amazing, cause surely have potential but with these changes will be a completely different mold or at least pretty far from the original Pietà. Rule of "ubi major minor cessit" can't be applied here cause if people that voiced for the new Pietà sculpt will not going to buy Pietà it will sound unfair, just my pov of course

 

Twigling already stated a few times that she's planning to have the original Pieta mold be the one used in the long layaway order, and that the new, modified mold would only be offered in later orders or maybe as an additional option in the long layaway (if it's released at all), and likely under a new name. So the concerns about no longer having the option of getting the Pieta head that was expected at the beginning of the long layaway aren't really an issue, for those who joined the long layaway preorder with plans to get Pieta.

 

THANK YOU. I really think it's time to layoff the tantrums over Pietà. How about some cheer up and get excited over Twigling's dolls spam? Tallulah is more than happy to kickoff a spam spree

 

Kiyakotari I was just sharing my humble opinion about this little Pietà debating, new mold is promising but i completely understand concearn for those that like Pietà orginal sculpt.It's great to have the chance to get Pietà with her original sculpt btw during long pre-order, that's all
Girrl i think that people that shared here their opinion aren't doing some tantrum, they just voiced their point of views, that's including me but no harm was intended.
But as far as Twigling setted decision to offer Pietà with her original scupt debating is closed

 

Honestly i don't see the issue regarding my tantrum, let's call it in that way, i was just voicing my opinion as buyer about Pietà changes, cause this sculpt is the reason why i joined the long layway pre-order. And to me matter is definitively closed here.

 

Here's my lovely Tishalulle, outside on a windy day:


Tishalulle by Ashbet, on Flickr

-- A

 

She is incredible!

 

All these Inginues make me excited for my girl! I need to get a mock up done of her to share with you all! Do you all find the small or large bust easier to shop for?

 

It will wonderful to see what plan you have for your Ingenue!!!!
I still have to do something barely decent for Oryx still looking for the right character to fit her!

 

Skittzlez2 pls do share i would love to see what you're planning for your character. I personally would chose bust size basing on easthetics, so my choice would be the small or medium one.

 

Girrls & Ashbet, I love your girls! I am looking forward to the time I can share my Newkiru. AT the moment, she only has one 'outfit' and the top is still giving me grief (I loath sewing arm openings and it is not tight enough overall ). It is not helped by the fact I am trying to create a jeans pattern for my Feeple65 (this is the 3rd week I spend on it ) so everything else is taking a back seat. Thanksfully my Eloy will share the same body as my venitu so when I get to him he'll already have some basic clothes to wear. I just wish the Timeless Body wasn't so expensive so I could buy a 2nd Venitu to give my Eloy his own body.

 

Im basing my Ingenue on Wylona Hayashi. Though there is much controversy around Wylona's photoshopped images I think that her pale skinned, dark haired, deep red lipstick give her the perfect look for my Succubi, Isodel. Since I am having trouble finding a blank photo of a pale Ingenue I'll have to do the mockup on the lightest one i can find. I can make a collage of a blank Ingenue next to a photo of Wylona here in a minute.

 

Try here:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/twigling/sets/72157650424099092
https://www.flickr.com/photos/twigling/sets/72157648104374294

 

I hope I don't add to the bad mood, but I need to settle this problem I'm having.
Twigling: You wrote somewhere that this tan skin color will be like Ingeniuese's, but the sample looks more like Iplehouse light brown or a similar darker color.
I was under the impression that the tan would be darker than the Ingeniuse tan (which is lovely, I have one), but I was only interested in Ingenue, if she could be as dark a tan as possible (which I know will never be as dark, as I would like, but the Ingeniuse is way, way too light). Can you confirm whether the new tan is more like Ingeniuese or a slightly darker tan like Iplehouse light brown?
I need to figure, what I'm gonna do, if I can't use Ingenue as I thought and intended.
(Please know, I blame no one but myself for this mistake! )

 

Skittzlez2 i've googled about Wylona Hayashi and i thought that Ingenue will be amazing with that look, you nailed the perfect style for her imo!

 

Thank you! Im so glad someone sees my vision! She will be snarky and beautiful and perfect!
[MENTION=238]twigling[/MENTION] thank you! That makes it so much easier!

Sent from my LG-LS980 using Tapatalk

 

I think Ingenue will portray this character pretty well, excellent choice dear!

 

Skittzlez2 > Oh yes ! I think the Ingenue mold is perfect for this character !
I just can't wait to see your girl !
I love my Ingenue soooooo much !