Dolls that *aren't* for beginners?

Oh my goodnes the D-one is it called?? I couldn't get it to stand at all. If any doll could put a beginner off, I think that would be it.

 

well, being a newb I personally wanted to go with some thing as affordable as possible my first go. I wouldnt want to dive in to any hobby gun-ho and spending-crazy even if I readily had 600 dollers to burn. and lets face it, who does right now? if you do, youre lucky, but even so, it seems just a little reckless. But I suppose its a matter of personal opinion.... but I suppose thats what the boards are all about, right!

 

Do your research and then pick the one you want. They just are not that hard, really. And in this economy it will be hard to sell one you arenot in love with.

 

I really don't think a beginner should be limited to a 'simple' or 'easy' doll. Being new to the hobby doesn't mean you'll be completely stupid about your doll. A newbie can research/study on how to do things they want with their doll, having other dolls isn't a prerequisite. (and on the other hand, there are owners with several dolls that they have owned a long time and yet they still faceup with poster paints and markers and leave their dolls in the sun)

 

what an interesting read - as a full fledged noob (ordered 3 pipos which have yet to arrive) i have been incredibly intimidated by some of the dolls i've seen featured here and elsewhere. my main concerns being general care and switching out of parts.

it also made me a little sad (and gave me a giggle) that quite a few folks view the SOOM monthly dolls as a little risky for a beginner as they're the exact non-anthro dolls that have swept me off my feet.

guess i'll wait for my 1st few bjd's to arrive and see if i have the stuff to step up to such an incredible doll next

 

My first doll was a sd megu. now i want a smaller doll

 

A lot of the questions and worries over what sort of doll, if any, would be answered very quickly if a newcomer were able to attend a meet-up.

Ask permission first, of course, but most people attending a meet are very happy to let you pick up their dolls, and bend the arms and otherwise get a feel for the doll.

Some people have dolls they do not want anyone else to touch ever. My own feeling, shared by my local groups, is that a doll so precious should probably stay safe at home.
But few people will feel really comfortable with some random person walking up and picking up their doll.

If your arms strain getting a 60cm doll off the table, you'd probably prefer a smaller doll.
If super-tinies (8" and under) have you reaching for a microscope, maybe you'd be happier with a larger doll.
Perhaps a certain frontal elevation is more to your tastes. (b***b size, i'm referring to here, often called 'Mature' for large. As an old phart with a moderate endowment, I know that's not where maturity lies.)

Anyway, there are plenty more things about dolls that any new enthusiast can learn very quickly from a doll in her or his hands, that photos may never show.
And your fellow enthusiasts are one of the best sources for hands-on advice, as well as being generally cool people.


Ann in CT
p.s. I think Domuya Flexi-bodies are awfully complicated for a newcomer, but a good friend of mine started with one & adores it. Different strokes for different folks, as the saying goes.

 

If they swept you off your feet, then that's what really matters most. People will always have different opinions about dolls--what one person thinks is too complicated, someone else has no problems with. That's why it's important to go for the dolls that you personally love.

 

go with whatever you love!
i disagree with alot of things people have said;
"do not go for the most expensive doll" well, if you really love the doll, it is better to save up for it and get the doll you really want instead of just trying to settle for a cheaper doll based solely on the fact that it is cheaper.
"do not get soom MDs as your first" why not? yea, they do tend to havwe alot more bits and pieces to them, but if you really love a doll...

not trying to call anyone out or anything! just stating my opinion :3

 

Personally, regardless of size, all BJD's are pretty much the same. I also concur with the suggestion that any newcomer to the hobby should attend a local meet-up. I was exposed to various sizes before I made my choice, and in the end my decision was based on what I fell in love with first... then the size. I'm expecting my second doll, another MSD, and now that I've been in the hobby a while I feel ready to add an SD to my collection once I am able.

It's really a matter of what you want to handle. Frankly, after a third doll, and an SD to boot, I don't have the room right now for any more. Evaluate the room you have available for your collection, and that just may tip the scale if you're on the fence.

 

I dont think that there should be a hard line rule but I would say that beginners may want to stay away from LE dolls. They tend to cost quite a bit more and should be handled with more care.

 

D:<
OH NO my first doll is going to be a soom MD - dun dun dun... but i kind of think it depends on the person, really. my take is that... if i'm going to spend some hundred bucks on dolls, i might as well buy one that ill treasure forever than someone first try-out, sort of cop-out first doll... especially it's my first, it's going to be extra special to me.

 

You are absolutely right, I think. No matter what doll you choose they are expensive anyway, so you could just as easy go for the one you truly want than spill your money on one you don't care about.

 

I do recommend going to a meeting to check out different sizes and options, however I attended my first meeting when I already had my first doll. Sometimes you're just confident in what you can handle by just thinking about it.
Some people say that you should go for a cheaper or smaller doll first like MSD sized doll, but when I was looking at different molds for my first doll there were hardly any mature minis and I wanted a mature looking doll. Or at least a doll that could pass for a 20 year old. That left me with de SD sized dolls and I never regretted that choice.

My first doll was a graduation gift from my parents and thus selling if I didn't like it was not an option. So I picked the doll that I really loved. I could have spared my parents' wallet and picked a "cheap" doll, but back then Dream of Doll was considered the cheap company together with Dollzone. I'm glad I didn't pick a "cheaper" MSD sized doll and got the doll that was what I wanted instead.
I know of people who bought a "try out" doll first and then said they couldn't sell it for the retail price anymore because the company upgraded the body since then and so many other dolls are on the secondary market. Don't just assume you will be able to sell a doll without loss of money.

Without ever having touched a BJD before I unstrung my first doll, sanded the seams, and restrung him within 24 hours after his arrival. All the information I needed was available on the internet and all it took was some confidence. (But I believed the misconception everybody did these things with their dolls and thought that in that case it couldn't be that hard.)

Very true. Even a cheap doll will cost you a lot of money. Think of shipping, custom fees, eyes, wigs, clothes, shoes, etc. A cheap doll may costs you close to $200 to $300. That's not really nothing in my opinion. I can't imagine most people want to just sand seams and restring their dolls, things for which you don't need to love the way a doll looks.
Most people will want to play with their dolls, pose them, take pictures and look at how pretty they've become. Pick a doll that will suit your interests. If you like a challenge, don't shy from the more complicated molds. If you are afraid of restringing for example, either find someone who could help you or go for the less intimidating molds. It would be a pity if someone bought a doll and is then afraid to touch it.

Other than that I'd say the sky (and your wallet) is the limit.

 

I was told hundred times that DOD's Kalix with grey resin shouldnt be my first doll but I just couldnt forget about him. He was the perfect doll for me and filled up all my imaginations. I cant agree to save my money and get some doll 'not for beginners' instead of some 'i truely love'. on this point, i dont really think there are dolls not for beignners. your own choice really should come first I guess.

 

I have to say that my first resin was a Domuya Flexi. I got her during their big promotion a few years ago and sort of bought without doing any research because she was 'on sale.' She was blank, naked, and looked like an alien :P Even though she couldn't (still doesn't want to!) stand worth a flip she was so beautiful and heavy and elegant. The only real letdown was the fact that her, ah, womanly curves, had a hard time balancing on those long stick legs and jointed feet. She was my 'starter doll' but she is still my first and favorite BJD!

For those that are put off by the thought of putting a Unoa together, it is surprisingly easy. The pictures are easy to follow and there is a really excellent step by step tutorial somewhere here on DoA. (thank you whoever you are!) I had never assembled or even restrung a doll before and was tempted to ship my Sist off to pay someone else to do it, but one day I just sat down and did it, it took about 20 minutes. Everything you need comes in the kit!


so I say, if you really love it, whether it's a less expensive Bobobie or one of those magnificent Soom MDs, get it!

 

I have to second the comment about second-hand dolls.

I bought my first doll secondhand and although I was very pleased with the purchase, I ended up removing the old faceup and blushing, re-doing the sueding, re-stringing, and spending hours and hours cleaning her. It was a terrible lot of work.

As happy as I am with the type of doll I chose, I wish I'd gone with one that was pristine from the original company and saved myself a lot of effort.

On the other hand, it's given me a crash-course in customizing and maintenance, and that's pretty cool, too.

I would just warn first-time buyers to really stop and think about how much time and energy they want to put into their first doll - do you want something you can take out of the box and it will look smashing, or do you want a doll that will be need some work first, that will be a project?

 

this is an excellent thread...it's helping me learn more about the dolls and what to possibly avoid and what to learn as i'm just starting out

 

do you have any experience of modeling? since bjd need a bit of it. no matter which you brought, one day you eventually need to do some maintenance..or worse, repair.
so, in my opinion, buy the one you really really really really love. to make sure one day if it has problems you wont abandon it.

 

I think that even though some dolls are "easier" to care for than others, that shouldn't affect what doll is your first. Sure, some basic knowledge is required, but nothing should hold you back from your dream doll. Do research, learn about the doll you want, know what the downsides there are (if any) along with the upsides. DoA is here as well to support everyone who needs help. A beginner shouldn't feel like they can't get their dream doll because it's not a "beginner" doll.

My two cents.
Kirsten

 

I kinda feel that one shouldn't start out with a limited edition doll or dolls that are too big (those that are above 70cm) because you are new afterall and you don't really know how to take good care of them (like my case).

But If you're confident and have several good buddies to help you along the way and what not, then I don't really think that there's any dolls that aren't meant for beginners.

 

i agree that Soom Monthlys are not realy for beginners since most are 1000 or more for those... also... i would say, anything about 60 might be a little big (unless your in dreamland because of the sculpt)

Starting small... Yo-sd ...msd... SD might be good. if you wanna do face ups msd or sd. Pukis are small which are awesome but for doing face ups starting a little bigger might be good to get the hang of it.

 

I actually have to disagree with all of those who say a person's first doll should not be an LE or Soom MD. Cause well..my first is a Soom MD. Ha.

I bought a IO off the marketplace and I've been taking amazingly good care of him. When I have questions I have two people that I can go to. I also did my homework and researched, attended meets, and was super careful when he came home. If I'm going to dish out hundreds of dollars for something I'm pretty sure I should take good care of it.

SO. If you do your homework, feel confident in the doll you're getting and know you can take proper care of him/her there is no reason you should be limited to who you can get!

 

Also I agree on the soom monthlys.
They look awsome but might be a little too much for beginners
I'm a newbie myself when it comes to dolls, I knew I wanted a msd sized doll, when he finaly arrived i was pleasantly suppised by his size, he was bigger than expected ( at first I was afraid I might find him too small)

I'm really glad I didnt have to put him together or anything, changeing his eyes for the first time was such a challenge, I felt nervous and was afraid of not being able to put them in straight

 

I totally agree! Who's to say beginner has to equal "lazy, careless idiot." There are people who have owned many dolls in the past, and have been an owner for years. Yet they still ruin each new doll they get either because they don't give a rip about their doll's condition, or don't bother to research proper care.

My first doll wasn't some practice doll/head that cost $100. It was the doll I wanted the very most, and I still have him today. I was brand new, yet I researched how to take care of him, and if I didn't know how to do something like a faceup, I would search the forums or elsewhere for the answer. My first doll isn't covered with gouges, scratches, yellowed, sharpied, or stained.

I think a beginner should get exactly the doll they want, ANY doll. Even if it's a one-off dark tanned fullset. I think they should ESPECIALY get it if it's a limited like soom's MDs. I mean while they're frittering away their time with a random "practice doll," their dream doll will sell out, and who knows if they'll have another chance. It's so easy and simple to find the answers you need on how to take care of your doll.

 

lol. I'm a fourteen year old girl so my mom was a bit...shocked when she found out my dolls are anatomically correct. She got over it but it's deffinitely something the person has to be mature enough to handel otherwise it just isn't for them until they can respect it not freak out over it's minor...parts.

 

I have not yet received either of my 2 first dolls. One of them is the Soom MD, Cuprit, the other is a tanned fullset, so I picked two that have been listed here as not for beginners! I'm going about this a bit different than suggested for beginners for sure! I wouldn't even consider trying face-ups or sanding, and I bought these dolls because I fell in love with them! I'm in my late 40's, and I can assure you, I will take perfect care of these beauties. I wanted my first two to come to me perfect, and my plan is to move forward from there with less expensive items to do face-ups and "play around" with. They're not bombs, they're dolls. Expensive dolls, so I have done 4 months of researching prior to ordering, but beginners should order the dolls that cause them to become beginners in the first place!

 

I agree completely! Reading this thread has really encouraged me that what I'm doing is the "right" way to go about it. What I mean is, I believe that ALL the ways to go about it are right, so long as the information is there and the decisions are careful.

I'm currently negotiating for my first doll, a Crobidoll Nia, secondhand. I'm also going to buy a Crobidoll Yeon-Ho head with the B faceup new from the site. So I'm going secondhand and new at the same time. My boys are already speaking to me - I don't know their names yet, I don't know what kind of heartache or difficulty I'll have with them. Maybe I'll have to restring my Nia as soon as I get him. But I'm asking his current owner to face him up for me, and I'm going to buy what I have to and make the rest, so that when he comes home he is clothed and beautiful for me. And then, after the shipping delay from Crobi, my Yeon-Ho will come in, and....Oh, goodness, I can't even wait. My breath gets soft just looking at his photos. He is The One for me.

I've been fond of BJD's for about five years now. I've always told myself, "You shouldn't just buy any old doll." Well, my boys aren't going to be "any old dolls." I've fallen for them. I am looking forward to welcoming them and taking care of them. The greatest mods I'm planning are earrings; the faceups, I'll leave to the professionals. My strength is sewing, and I'm going to make my boys the best wardrobe they can have. I know what I want out of this hobby, and I'm already wincing at the price - *but I'm still going through with it,* because settling for any lesser dolls than the ones I best want would be a waste of any amount of money that I would spend on them.

I can't wait to hold them.

 

I'm hoping to get a my first doll soon and I think this has been a big help
I think it really depends on the person, I wouldn't mind getting a big doll, it's more of a challenge for me And besides, it'll be heaps of fun to play with poses

 

I think there is a big difference between being a part of a local doll community or having BJD friends before getting your first doll and getting your first doll alone. Some people don't have the luxury of having friends to ask for advice and they pretty much have to go it alone with their first doll. I think it is those people most people think of when they think of a complete beginner.

It's ok getting a complicated doll with lots of optional parts like a Soom MD or a Volks SD16 girl with those interchangeable legs if you have someone to run to if you have issues with it, but if you're on your own it's probably best getting a standard doll with a million tutorials like an SD-sized or a MSD-sized doll. If anything you'll at least be able to find out how to string them safely and there are loads of sources for off the peg clothes for these standard sizes while you learn to sew for your doll.

Since Soom's MDs are not regular editions, they won't have any tutorials attached, so it will be pretty hard to do research on that type of doll.

 

Most beginners I see around aren't eager to do something themselves - they are afraid to change eyes, really, fearing they "damage" the doll somehow. Restringing or make-up are regarded as something only an "expert" should do.

But then, there are some very enthusiastic beginners, who buy floating head without a make-up, looking for a body from different company, aren't afraid of modding - and are happy with second-hand or limited dolls.

So... it's really "whatever goes". I think former person will be unhappy with "model kit" doll, and latter might think "ready-made" (brushing included) doll boring.

As for size - I myself started with 70+ doll and thought tinies and pukis as too small for my liking. I fell for them only after handling other people pukis. Then again, one friend of mine started with a puki and now looking for MSD )) She literally "grows up" in the hobby.

I'd say - "research" yourself is even more important, then doll caring research. You just should know what you really want, whatever it is. The "rule" about you should like your first doll may be the only one that applies, really. Of course, we can always sell "wrong" doll, but it's not good to begin with disappointment.

 

I think a lot of this really does vary person-to-person. I'm a very hands-on person. I love taking things apart and putting them together again, I love customizing things (even if I'm not very good), and I'm not too afraid of screwing up. While I started with a 'normal' doll, I probably could've handled something like a Soom MD easily.

One of my close friends, on the other hand, she just got her first doll. She's not a very crafty person and the complexity of the dolls can worry her a bit. Knowing her personality (and her price range), we got her a Bobobie Mei. She loves her doll, and I was able to show her how to tighten the strings, along with wiring the doll so she'd stand better, things she probably wouldn't have imagined doing on her own, but were no problem for me.

 

Well, my first "bjd" was a vinyl version. As much as I love the sculpts of these dolls and not having the fear of them breaking, I soon realized that I wanted more. They aren't as posable as resins that I can tell. Seeing the wonderful posed pictures alone tells me that. Also I don't believe they are restringable, and if they are it would be alot of work (warming of the vinyl and such). So these "affordable" starter bjd's were enough to tell me to stop splashing in the wading pool and jump off the cliff into the ocean below!!! I'm actually in the process of "trying" to decide which resin doll I want first. Oh sooooo many choices. One thing I do know is I want her pretty much now. I don't really want to wait 4 or 5 months. At this point I don't care if she is strung and if she has a face-up or not (I have someone in mind to commission - and that would be faster than waiting 4 or 5 months!). If she is strung it would just take me longer to force myself to "learn" the stringing process. If she isn't - well no harm no foul (at least that's what I'm thinking), I can't ruin something that wasn't already there - right? The only thing limiting my choice right now is the fact that I want to get a resin bjd that can use current wigs, eyes, and clothes I already have. But that's not really a problem as most of the bjd's that I like already will!
Now just waiting for my tax return check and watching the waves below!!!

 

I would say get a standard sized doll for a starter doll, just because depending on if you like males or females you could be in for a lot of frustration with a first doll. My big girl is my first large girl and I had an idea how hard it would be to find clothes for her, but never realized how truly annoying it is until it was time to look. No company makes anything she would actually wear in her size Anything that I would want has to be commissioned or made myself.

Something like that would've pissed me off if I hadn't already learned that "people just don't get big girls". They buy big guys, so there are lots of 70cm guy clothes, but to find the same styles for females is almost impossible.

Also, I would like to think that a not so good starter doll would be one made of french resin, just because a new owner might freak if they didn't know what they were getting into when they bought it.

Doing your homework on the size that you're after, the company you're purchasing from, and what the doll's made of probably determine a large factor in how good or bad your first experience is. When it comes to size, I think you should go with something similar to what you're used to, unless you're really sure you can handle something that's a big jump in either direction.

My good friend saw my 60cm dolls and freaked at how large they were, because she was only used to 1/6 scale resin kits. *shrug*

 

By that logic, no one should get a soom MD or something with more complicated stringing. If the stringing is so much different than your average doll, then your average doll owner wouldn't be able to restring it right? If someone who knows how to restring a standard doll can apply that knowledge and figure out how to restring a more complicated doll, then a beginner can look at a tutorial for restringing a standard doll and apply THAT knowledge to restringing a more complicated doll.

It's like saying someone who's first learning to drive should never try to learn a stick-shift. Sure it may be harder or take more time, but it will have a lot of payoff in the end, and if they can do that, they can do anything.

I feel very strongly that the type of doll a person gets should depend on their likes, their personality, and what they're willing to do rather than their past experience.

 

No, it means that some completely new beginner who has never seen or touched a resin doll before might find a huge doll with complicated stringing a challenge they wouldn't appreciate first time around. Some people do like a challenge, but other people don't, especially with their first ever doll. YMMV.

Clearly your average doll owner, by privilege of actually owning dolls, will have handled BJDs before and will have a good working knowledge of how to put them together, but someone who has never seen a BJD in real life probably wouldn't. There really isn't a substitute for stringing a doll yourself, no matter how many tutorials you read. There are also people here who have got their first doll with no research whatsoever and are surprised when the Unoa-sized jeans and the 7-8 wig they bought won't fit their new SD.

I'm not saying complicated dolls are off limits for anyone, but I know what its like to come into the hobby and buy my own doll when I had never had the opportunity to see one myself beforehand. If I bought an odd-sized doll simply because I liked it and did no other research whatsoever, and on arrival found it was pretty limited in what it could wear, I'd be pretty disappointed.

Also, most people in the UK learn to drive manual cars, I don't know anyone who drives an automatic. So from a British perspective, should we who drive predominantly manual cars buy predominantly complicated dolls?

 

I learned to drive a stick, not an automatic. I have owned automatic trans cars and have always felt like that wasn't really driving!
I drive a stick and ordered complicated dolls, I've never seen any reason to limit myself, thinking I "can't" do something. My mother raised me with the mantra "you can do anything you want"! And I do. Sucessfully.

 

I feel there aren't any dolls that aren't suitable for beginners. If you like it, buy it and find out on forums how they "work". I never restring my own dolls, because that's the only thing about BJDs that I find hard, and I met some friends on the forums that can do it for me. Anyone can do that I believe.
We all had to learn in the beginning, right?

 

Yes, some people dislike a challenge, but others like one. This has absolutely nothing to do with being a beginner, and everything to do with personality. There are many long time doll owners that have never restrung their dolls, done a faceup, etc...

I disagree. A detailed tutorial can show a person exactly what to do. Restringing is not a complicated process at all. If you can put beads on a string, you can restring a doll. It takes no timing, no intricate movements (like painting a faceup would), you really don't need to have owned dolls to do it. Also, being too lazy to do research has nothing to do with being new. I agree that there are certain personalities that shouldn't own certain dolls, but to assume every new doll owner is lazy and stupid is very offensive.

Again, being too lazy to find out anything about the product you're buying is a personality issue, and not part of being new. I think first time owners will research MORE than someone who owns multiple dolls would. Since it's their first time.

That's not what I was saying at all. It was an analogy. If you buy a Sard, learn to blush and restring on a Sard, then later on down the line, standard strung dolls such as delfs will be easy for you.

 

bolded parts are mostly what i'm referring to.

Now lets try this again, since my net window freaking crashed when i had a nice response going. >>;;

Some people like a challenge, and some people don't. Those some people who liek a challenge are the ones who are gonna buy their first doll blank and go head first and try their faceup. and *gasp* omg, removing a head.

Re: stringing. Restringing is a part of the lives of these dolls. It happens. Sometimes, it HAS to happen. Sometimes the string snaps and you're forced to restring, scared or not. No, i agree, theres no replacement for doing it yourself, but that also doesnt mean that a person's first doll has to be something with the simplest stringing. Everyone can learn. Its not that hard.

anecdote: My friend and i ordered our first dolls at the same time, and she got hers first, and he was TIGHT. So, the first night i saw him, only about three weeks after she got him (and didnt do much with him) we were gonna restring him. Note: I'd never done more than held one for more than a few seconds. And that was only once, a few months prior--and she'd only seen her first when she got him! Imagine that, her first doll, a limited Delf Lu Wen--with pesky extra knee joint parts! (please note: extreme sarcasm is present) We unstrung him, thinking we could loosen him, only to realize that theres no extra string after the knot ends, and he was so tight we couldnt get him restrung. We resorted to using craft elastic, which failed miserably, but held him over till we got him restrung properly. Doest hat make us horrible first dolly owners? No, it means we were willing to dive right in. (Also note, she got him blank ^.~)



...and in regards to the last part, "If i got an oddly sized dolll.....i'd be really disapointed" why would you be disapointed? Would you be disapointed that the doll was an 'odd size'? That you couldnt get clothes? Or would you be disapointed in yourself because you'd failed to do the research prior to shelling out 100-700+ for a doll you bought based on looks alone?

I feel that if someone is willing to spend that kind of money on something, they'd better be willing to find out why they're spending that much. (and btw, "odd size" is basically ANY DOLL IN THIS HOBBY. Our dolls are not barbie/fashion doll sized, nor ar they '18-inch'/american girl sized. Just a thought.) If someone's gonna buy their first doll without doing research, without checking out what they're buying, then they're kinda...dumb? Sorry if thats offensive to anyone....but here and now, knowing what these dolls are, whats inside, how they work, and, omg, that their hair comes off and you can take their eyes out!, would you honestly not do research prior to buying? Or, if you DID buy one, to find that your pretty thing from the internet came with no hair, no clothes, and was weird and strung....wouldnt that stop you right there and make you check it out? Or would you just drop it, thinking it'd be okay, or pull out a sharpie to do the makeup? Serioulsy now.


To keep going with the car reference that you brought up.....Would you buy a car that was selling for a very high price (compared to other cars, like these would be compared to most dolls you'd see in toy stores) if you didnt nkow what was under the hood or why it cost so much, but just based on the color or shape? *and by under the hood, i don't mean knowing exactly what the engine is or does or how it works. I don tknow that. i dont WANT to know that. But i mean, if you saw an *insert awesome/macho car here* and bought it without finding out that it had like....a really old and dead engine in it (ie, lols, it wont run. ever.) and without asking anything about it or checking up on it.......now that wouldnt be very smart, now would it?



Oh MAN this is long ><;;

tl;dr: Y'know. If you're gonna spend the money, know what you're spending it on. If someone's willing to throw out this kind of money for something they don't know anything about....then they get what they deserve. If they're not willing to do the research and find out just what they're buying, so be it. let them.

and on the thought of "shoulds" and "should nots" for who should get what doll from what company......should *insert company here* deny someone a purchase because they didnt read the right stuff? Should they have a test first? Multiple choice: What should you NOT use on your doll: A) acrylic paint B) MSC C) oil pastels D) chalk pastels. nah. that'd be kinda silly and really intimidating, don't you think? XD

 

I'm waiting on my first doll - Ojallin from Dollga/Leeke and she's pretty large. I'm excited and nervous... I have never handled a BJD before but heck I can't wait! I'm excited about changing her eyes, wig etc... I've read everything on BJD's more than twice and I'm confident that I'll be alright - I love learning and love doing things with my hands. I might mess up along the way, but hey, that's part of the fun!

 

I'm waiting on my first doll too. Luts Kid Delf, Bory. I fell in love with him and, even after I shopped around, he was still me fav. I don't think a msd sized doll would be that difficult to take care of for my first. But those more detailed 80cm ones... like the ones SOOM make, they are beautiful and I'm always looking at them for long periods of time, but they'd be too much work, don't you think? If you didn't know what you were doing.

 

Torren, is this about me, or is this a general commentary, because your tone and direction of your comments are getting personal. If there's something you want to say to me, take it to PM because no where in my posts have I been particularly critical of anyone. If your tone is just relating to your original post getting lost, I apologise for reading it wrongly.

I do think people should get the doll they want, but maybe a complicated doll wouldn't suit most beginners, not all of them but you know, the type of people who are too scared to change a pair of eyes at first. And as for stringing being not that hard, I know this, you know this. How do we know it? Because we've done it ourselves. A lot of new beginners pointedly avoid restringing until they absolutely have to because it does sound like a big job if you haven't done it before and have never seen someone else do it before.

And I'm not calling beginners lazy at all, Nefla. I was a beginner once too and I was scared of restringing because lots of tutorials recommended me using haemostatic clamps to keep the tension of the string, and if something calls for haemostats it sounds pretty extreme to me since it's a surgical instrument!! Putting something off because it sounds like something very difficult isn't lazy, it's just cautious for someone who has just bought a $300 doll and doesn't want to ruin it.

So, are you guys saying the only 'good' dolly owner is the person who buys a doll and dives straight in with stringing, face-ups etc? I have a few dolly friends and not many of them are that hands-on. Sewing and knitting for dolls is our creative outlet rather than modding, face-ups and stringing, so are we not as good as the people who do buy blank dolls?

 

Mabe they mean those who know what they are getting into before they actually get the doll? O.O

 

This is a very good point, and the exact reason it took me so long to do my first restringing. It isn't complicated, technical, or delicate. But it does require you to "break" that expensive doll you waited 4 months to get.

As far as complicated dolls go, I'm going to have to say the opposite: I would be wary about Bobobie/Resinsoul. Don't get me wrong. They're wonderful dolls. I love my Ju very much, and would happily purchase her again. But it took quite a bit of work to get her to pose correctly. That includes restringing multiple times, S-hooks/no S-hooks, sueding, and (eventually) wiring. All that work can be daunting for a beginner. More info here.

If you really want something more complicated (like a Soom MD) for your first doll, go for it! It's more likely to "just work" right out of the box. While I'm positive you'll have to restring it eventually, you'll have some time to get to know how the doll works before taking it apart.

 

I just don't like the way you seem to be generalizing all new people into one group. A new person doesn't neccesarily= a person who is nervous or afraid to do anything to their doll, and a long time owner doesn't necessarily=someone who has done it all and feels comfortable with doing everything. And nowhere did I say that not restringing or doing faceups is lazy. I said not bothering to do research was lazy. But ok, lets say for a minute that all new doll owners are afraid of damaging their doll, so they don't restring, do faceups, mods, blushing, etc...none of that stuff is even required in doll ownership. For those who don't want to do those things, the doll company(or a freelance customizer) will do it for them for a fee.

I'm just trying to defend the newbies here. If somone's dream doll is a Soom MD or something, I'd hate to see them pressured to get a doll they don't like as much because veteran doll owners think they can't handle it. I think the most complicated doll on the market right now is the new dollshe body, but even that can be figured out. If a person (even a newbie) takes it slow, and works with it, they will get to know its' kinks and such. Humans are smart creatures.

 

I agree with this. There are things about abjds that pose challenges (especially the first time you try and resting, or do a faceup, or sued etc), but there's a difference between a challenge and beat-your-head-against-the-wall-near-to-impossible. Nothing really requires a professional--all the various tweaking that gets done with dolls can be done by their owners, and there are some things a person can't get away from doing. All dolls eventually have to be restrung no matter if it's a Bobobie, a Volks, a CP, Souldoll, Dollshe etc. and the first time someone restrings is always going to be the first time whether they've had the doll for a day or a year. It helps to have a second pair of hands and some moral support, but there's no reason with all the resources available on-line that owners can't do it themselves.

Whether a new person feels they handle adding to the complexity by picking a doll that needs more tweaking straight off or has a more complicated stringing or jointing system is completely up to them. There is no right or wrong way--they have to read up on the doll and decide if it's for them. I don't think there's any way to categorize a particular doll as a beginner or advanced doll, since so much comes down to personal preference--some people might find doll A very easy to pose straight out of the box while others would completely disagree. Some people may be intimidated by more complicated jointing, while others aren't at all bothered by it.

While it's possible for people to have abjds and not get into the customization aspect of them, it's still what the dolls are intended for, and they all have a certain DIY quality to them that soon to be owners should be aware of.

 

Personally I think you should start this hobby with a doll you really want and is worth saving up and spening all that money on. So what if its a Soom Limited or something with complicated systems? I just think it would be rediculous if you ended up buying something you dont really want just because you are a "beginner" and people apparently tell you to get something simpler.

Den of Angels is full of people that would be willing to help if they are having trouble. I mean.. hey.. Im in this hobby for almost 2 years now and I still dont know how to restring a doll, or do a face up.. or whatever. And I am positive there are others like me out there. I have someone do it for me. So I dont really see the problem people are talking about .

 

Who is pressuring anyone in this thread to get a doll they're not interested in? A suggestion isn't a demand, nor is it a contract. If someone desperately wants that limited doll to be their first, they'll find a way to make it happen. It just so happens that the newbies I have the most experience with (in any hobby I've been a part of) are the people who aren't so keen on doing everything themselves from the word go, so that's the type of person I think of when I think of a complete beginner, so I'm tailoring my response to those people in particular. Neither am I the only person in this thread to have given this particular answer.

 

i went to my first doll meet before i actually had a doll, and i was terrified to handle other people's dolls, in case i broke them... my first doll was my 14cm catsy... i think that worked out terrifically-it got me used to the way BJDs moved and kicked and flopped before I got my first multi-pounder

 

^This. DoA is full of people who can help a newbie out and you can find many tutorials here. When I bought my first doll I had no idea how to restring him but a simple picture-tutorial on the site of Luts helped me out a lot.

 

But if a person who is "new" in the hobby, finds a "complicated" doll they want to buy as their first one, I imagine they are the type that has already done their research, looked around on other Doll sites, seen whats out there, and still have decided that they want that complicated one? They are just going to go for it anyway.

Lets remember, All Ball jointed dolls are still made out of Resin, they are all strung by Elastic, connected with hooks. If they are a newbie.. they are going to have just as much trouble restringing a dimple Delf or Dollzone as much as a Soom Limited or Souldoll Centaur.

I think most people in this hobby have done research or joined this forum or another before they bought their doll. Newbies might not want to do everything themselves off the bat, but that is what we are here for, Right? Regardless of the type of doll they got as their first, There will always be people to help them.

 

Regarding my tone, I'd actually like to ask if you'd be willing to reread it, throwing out the part of my original attempt crashing and the fact that i'd quoted you and bolded a few things i was responding to. I might be missing it, since I wrote it in the first place, but i'm honestly not seeing the hostility or personal comments in there, and I apologize if it comes off that way. (I'd also like to ask anyone else if they see that in my post too o_O;; ) I certainly did not mean any more than to state my opinion, respond to a few things that you had said, and perhaps use some sarcasm to get my points accross. The sarcasm could have been taken badly, but thats kinda why i labeled it as such ^^;;


Actually, after this post, i quite agree with you for the most part. There are a lot of people who are willing to dive right in and do everything they can right off. From changing eyes and taking off the head right down to restringing, faceuping, and sanding/modding, everythings game. Others get their doll and are scared to touch it. This is also regarding your reasoning for being afraid of restringing, and heamostatic clamps ( which i've never heard of btw. I'm looking that up now XD; ). I personally think a lot of the reason so many people are scared to do anything (right down to simple posing nd changing eyes) is because so much of the hobby is driven by the fourms and what people read here, which can often be scary sounding which can turn them away from trying things--Just like you said with restringing and how too many people make it out to be a big difficult job that takes five people to do (exaduration, of course XD) when in fact it can be quite simple and a one person job.

Also, i agree with Nefla. She never said you called all beginners lazy, nay, i believe she called some beginners lazy. (Which i did, too)(and forgive me if i missed something where she accused you of that) I agree with her statement that what a beginner is willing to do is up to their personality. Some people might be the crazy hands on type that wants to do a modded hybrid and do the faceup and everything on their first doll, and another might want one thats more simple, but i believe that its often aparent to these people what they prefer and that they'll be smart enough to go after what they wish to do. The person who likes things simple isnt going to make a five part hybrid as their first. They'll avoid it, and rightly so, and the people willing to dive into the deep end on the first try, so to speak, will do so.


Now, as clarification (at least on my part) I never said or intended to insinuate that only good owners jumped in full force, willing to mod and faceup right away. What i did insinuate was that "good" new owners are more along the lines of those willing to learn as much as they can and know what they're buying and everything thats possible with a bjd. Someone who gets their first doll and doesnt realize that the faceup didnt come with it, or the eyes or wig or clothes didnt come with it, who is too lazy (yes, lazy) to scroll down the page to read the specs or click away to read teh FAQ on a site? These are the ones that i believe you are referring to when you generalize "newbs", but they're not the only newbies out there. the "good" newbies are the ones who read the sales page/FAQ, and find something like DoA and read the information available.
--I just mean that theres a difference between informed and not informed, not completely hands-on and not. Whether you're willing to do your own faceup or not, the difference is knowing what a faceup is and that its not permanent rather than being willing or not to do it.



As a final note, perhaps it was my comment regarding your examle of the newbie who got an 'odd sized doll' and was dissapointed that you took as a personal attack, but i found that as a perfect example of the difference between newbies who are willing to know what they're buying before they spend however much it costs and newbies who buy on the impulse of "i want pretty things~"
-that, and it often sounded as if you were generalizing all newbies into one category of "lazy and uninformed," as you never seemed to make a distinction between the different sorts of newbies. I apologize if i misread anything and you in fact were. ^^

 

It was only because you went through my post, bolding specific parts when all I'd been saying were things that have already been said before by other people, it just seemed your comments were particularly directed at me rather than everyone else who has said similar things. I'm not the only person with a different view to the majority.

And the complete beginners I have experience with are the people who are scared of ruining this expensive, pretty doll by doing anything more than taking it out of the box, because those are the people I've got experience with, I didn't say that beginners were 'lazy and uninformed' at all, however, I also know that many people don't do any research whatsoever before getting their first doll too, so there's that kind of beginner too. Perhaps these people don't do research because they don't realise a BJD needs maintenance or they don't do research because they don't want to, not because they're particularly lazy individuals. Some people are researchers, some people aren't.

I've never actually met a complete new beginner who was so 'gung-ho' about their doll that they'd take on a disassembled, blank, eyeless, wigless doll and go it alone. I know those people are out there, but I figured that kind of newbie isn't likely to ask "which doll should I get because it's beginner friendly?", they're more likely to ask "which doll offers me the greatest challenge?" so why would they look at this particular thread? Comments like mine are of more help to the person who is on the fence between two beautiful dolls, one slightly more challenging than the other, and is wondering what kind of doll would suit their needs when all they want is a doll. The person who knows they love a challenge wouldn't need to read the pros-and-cons in a thread like this.

I only found DoA after I got my first doll, not before. So all the information here wasn't open to me at first. I didn't destroy my doll or put a sharpie to her face. The amount of new beginners with common sense far outstrips the amount of new beginners who won't know one end of a Super Dollfie from the other, I know this and nowhere did I say that new beginners are stupid and/or lazy

 

Yeah, but people really arent as stupid as you try to make them seem. Would'nt a $500 pricetag on something as a doll start ringing bells? That no, it wouldnt be wise to do the faceup of a doll with a sharpie?

Lets be completely honest here, because we all know it's true. People who dont realize, or neglect the fact that asian ball jointed dolls need as much attention as they do, are usually the people who go for the cheapest companies, and want a doll just to have one, so they go for the cheaper option. I am not saying everyone is like that, and Im not trying to give cheaper companies a bad name. But we have all seen it happen.

Anyone who would be willing to pay the amount that limited and complicated dolls cost, can realize that this isnt going to be easy.

If these people don't have acess to den of angels or some other kind informative sites that can help them, they probably also won't realize that they are getting a "complicated" doll, and they will also have no one to tell them that getting that for their first doll isn't a good idea. So I don't see the difference.

Ofcourse most newcomers are scared that they might damage their new doll. But thats where I come back to my original point, No matter what. A BJD is still a BJD. They would be just as scared of damaging their not so limited or expensive doll as a limited and expensive doll.

It really all does come down to the same problem if something were to happen to it. The only difference is they price they payed for it. If you didnt realize that you cant leave them standing alone unnatended, and they tumple off the table and break their nose off. It's not going to matter wether or not it was a limited doll. It still happend and your precious brand new doll just broke their nose off. Chances are same thing would have happend with a not limited or complicated doll.

 

Is this directed to me? I just said I haven't said that anyone is stupid or lazy. How about I direct your attention to the very part where I say this?;

 

May I ask what your first doll was? Chances are, that someone who didnt have acces to informative sites, other BJD owners and DoA, probably wouldnt have found those sites with the complicated dolls in the first place. They would have just stumbled across the more populair sites as DOD and Luts. And even if they did find other sites, and they have no realization of what the BJD community really is. Even though it says on the site that the doll they are about to purchase is special or Limited, if they dont realize that people in the BJD community are going to fight over it. So they won't take it as something special anyway, won't give it a second thought, and will just go for it.

And if they are really that uninformed about BJD's then they wont realize that you are ABLE to restring them.. or customize them.. if they truely havent been exposed to any information. Which I really do doubt.

When I came across the DOD site years ago. I didnt know that you could customize them. I didnt know you could change their wigs, their eyes etc. I didnt have the money at the time, but if I had the money, I would have just gotten one of their dolls away. Because I didnt know there was such a huge BJD community, there was no one to stop me, so I would have just bought it anyway. And you cant stop the people you dont know about because they arent in the community. Its most likely just going to happen anyway.

I completely see where your points are coming from, Jescissa. But if someone who has no information on BJD's, and is still getting one.. well, how can we stop that? Just like people werent able to tell you how to treat a BJD you when you got your first BJD before you joined DoA.

And the people who DO find this place before their first doll, they have the information, they have people to help. And then it will all work out.

 

I'm in the camp that says that there's no such thing as a doll that's not for beginners. It just depends on the person and what they feel that they are up for. My first doll was one of the Iplehouse EIDs, which I've seen mentioned a few times in this thread. I haven't had him that long either. I got him blank, and did my own face-up. Within a week or so I had taken him all apart and sanded, tightened, and restrung him. The restringing took maybe 30 minutes, tops. I didn't even have to open the little booklet they send with instructions to do it.

I've seen the restringing instructions for the new Dollshes, and it looks pretty easy and straight forward to me. I guess it all depends on how inclined you are to fiddiling with things. I would have no qualms about getting a pile of parts and having to put them together myself, actually I might prefer it.

 

I think it just all depends on the type of person and/or how much DIY work needs doing on the doll. Getting a doll that requires a lot of care like that may not be good for some beginners, but others could be really good naturally when it comes to that sort of thing. It just all depends, there's really no set doll for the entire newbie population that they shouldn't get because it'll very from person to person.

 

Haha, there's more debate going on here than in the debate subforum.

Yes there are the types of newbies that will be afraid to do things to their doll, and yes there will be the type of newbies that will dive right in, but what I keep trying to say, is that it has nothing to do with being new. It has everything to do with personality. Just replace the word "newbies" in that statement with "people" and it's far more accurate.

When I got my first doll (CP Yder) I ordered him blank, naked, and ordered eyes and a wig from separate places. Within my first week, I had unstrung him, stretched his leg elastic on a chair overnight, restrung him, bought approved faceup materials, made a fur wig he could wear until his arrived, and done a faceup. I didn't know anyone who had a bjd, or someone who could help me, but I found doing all those things to be remarkably easy. Did this have anything to do with the type of newbie I was? No. It has to do with the type of person I am. You have no idea what kind of personality or background a person has when comming into this hobby. I had been an artist for over 10 years. I knew how to sew already, and most importantly, I am a patient person and a logical thinker. We aren't just all brainless when we start out. If a sharpie is a permanent marker then gee wiz it's going to be permanently on my doll. You don't need years of doll experience to tell you that, or to put a doll back together the way you took it apart.

As for the whole research thing...I think if you DON'T research a $500 item you're buying for the first time it's just foolish.