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Tutorial What you need to know about respiratory protection!

Sep 21, 2010

    1. [​IMG]
      Tek's Respirator FAQ

      Are you qualified to talk about this?
      Yes. I am a Certified Respiratory Protection Tester/Trainer with extensive training in respiratory protection. I work at a company where my staff are exposed on a daily basis to some of the most harmful chemicals in industry. They can and will be exposed to things like silica, isocyanates and cyanide gas. Their short and long-term health is in my hands and I take that very seriously. Deadly seriously, in fact.

      What is respiratory protection?
      Respiratory protection is a part of your Personal Protective Equipment (PPE) designed to filter or block harmful substances from reaching your respiratory system. The hobbyists primary form of respiratory protection is the respirator. There are a great number of types of respirators, some useful only for certain applications (see more on this below). The two most common respirators for hobbyists are the disposable respirator and the half-face respirator.

      The half-face respirator is a mask that covers your nose and mouth, and has cartridges that clip on, screw on, or otherwise attach to ports on the mask.

      The disposable respirator looks like a dust mask or surgeon's mask. It is, as the name implies, made to be disposed of after a short period of time.

      Why do I need it?
      Many of the items that we work with as doll customisers are toxic and many of them are cumulatively toxic. You may feel ill for a while and then get better, but the sorts of diseases that can be caused by sanding processes and spraying processes can come back to haunt you many years down the road. These products can cause Cancer and Pneumoconiosis. Cancer may be treatable if caught early enough. Pneumoconiosis, which is respiratory diseases like asbestosis, silicosis and coalworker's "black lung" disease, is NOT TREATABLE. Your doctors will work hard to make you comfortable while you die. That is the most they will be able to do for you. If you get Pneumoconiosis you will DIE.

      Are you scared? You should be. This is life and death. Do not play Russian Roulette with your health.

      What do I need?
      That depends on the application that you are going to be using your respiratory protection for.

      Sanding
      For sanding applications (including sanding of resin, apoxie and other sculpting materials, and wood), you need a respirator that provides at least N95 level protection. It should say N95 somewhere on the mask itself. If it doesn't say, it is not good enough. There is a scale to protection levels and anything above N95 is also acceptable (of course).

      The levels are:
      N95
      P95
      N100
      P100

      What does this mean? The prefix ahead of the number will tell you if the mask is Oil Proof or Not.

      The number will tell you the percentage effectiveness of the filter against particles of less than 0.3 Microns. An N100 or P100 filter may also be known as a HEPA filter.

      On the bright side, having a small supply of these types of respirators will mean that you are following CDC and WHO recommendations for infectuous disease outbreaks, which may or may not include the Inevitable Zombie Apocalypse.

      P100 filters are also effective in welding applications.

      N95 and above filters are most commonly found in the disposable variety and may also be referred to as "dust masks" or "surgical masks". Remember, if it doesn't say N95 (or one of the other codes listed above) it is not good enough!

      Spray
      This includes all types of spray applications, whether you are spraying sealant (like MSC or Testors) or airbrushing or spraying paints.

      The process of spraying releases aerosols (and this is true whether or not you are using an aerosol spray can product. Airbrushing paint creates aerosols too!) for which an N95 filter is not effective.

      At this point, you will need to move into a mask that protects you against Organic Vapours AND has an N95 filter. This will mean moving into a half-face respirator.

      Your respirator is no longer disposable and can be used again and again without ill effect; the only thing that will need replacing is your filter and (if applicable) your prefilter. Some respirator brands have an N95 filter built right into the Organic Vapour cartridge, but I recommend looking for one that does not, for ease of replacement. Cartridges and filters have different life spans and it is more economical to replace only the part that requires replacing (more on this below!).

      Okay! I've got my mask, I'm totally safe now right?
      No. There are three things that can negatively impact the safety of your mask; poor fit, improper maintenance and environmental levels.

      Poor Fit
      A respirator (of any type) is completely and utterly useless if it is the wrong size for you and is not fitted properly. Please ensure you've read the section on fitting your mask to ensure that your mask is correctly fit.

      Improper Maintenance
      Your respirator is equally useless if you are not properly maintaining and caring for it. This includes care of the mask between uses and replacement. Please see the section on maintaining your mask for more information.

      Environmental Levels
      Environmental levels are important to take into account, as your mask can only protect you against the things it was designed to protect you against up to a certain concentration. since I'm sure none of us have the money or inclination to commit to environmental testing of our workspaces, the best way to ensure this is to make sure that the area in which you are working is properly ventilated before you start your project, and until well after you are finished.

      Open your windows or work outside so that there is fresh air circulating in the area you're working in. If the air is particularly still (no breeze) while you're working, it is worth investing in a simple fan. Set it up in your window, with the fan blowing out the window (ie: the front of the fan where the air blows from facing towards the window). This will help pull the toxins out of your room. Alternately, if you are working outdoors, set the fan up on your table to help promote air movement.

      How do I know if it fits?
      According to my local Occupational Health and Safety Code, a respirator cannot legally be used in a workplace environment if it has not been correctly Fit Tested. Keep in mind that half-face respirators come in various sizes. Most women and men wear a medium but if you have a particularly slender or wide face, you may need a small or large. If you have a crooked nose, or sinus problems, look for a mask made of silicon; you will find it more comfortable than plastic or rubber.

      Fit Testing
      Fit testing uses a noxious but harmless substance (usually either irritant smoke or Bitrex; an additive used to create bitterness in household cleaners to prevent children from tasting them) to ensure that the seal between the mask and the face is tight and proper. Qualitative fit testing is the most common type, and requires the user of the mask to confirm the presence of the noxious substance. In some cases (depending on chemicals in the environment or failure of the Qualitative test) Quantitative fit testing may be required; this type of fit testing uses scientific sensors to record levels inside the mask. If you have access to fit testing, especially with a half-face respirator, I encourage you to take advantage of it! Fit testing needs to be redone every two years, in the case of weight loss or gain of more than 15 lbs or in the case of surgery (including dental) involving the face.

      And if I don't have access?
      I have done hundreds of fit tests for staff at my place of employment and I can usually tell how well a mask is likely to fit prior to the fit test being done. This is done with a simple self test. In order to be effective this test must be done every single time you use the respirator (even if you pull it down to talk to someone and put it right back on!).

      For Disposable
      Step 1:
      Put your respirator on.
      Step 2: Cup your hands tightly over your mouth and nose, over top of the respirator.
      Step 3: Suck in a long breath. You will get air, but it should all be coming in through the small cracks between your fingers. You should not feel any air coming in from around the nose piece or under your chin. If you do, refit the mask and try again. If you cannot complete this successfully, you will need either a larger or smaller mask.
      Step 4: With your hands still over your mouth and nose, blow out. Again, you should feel the air moving past your fingers, and never around the bridge of your nose or under your chin.

      For Half-Face
      Step 1:
      Put on your mask and make sure the straps are tight.
      Step 2: Cover the cartridge, as much as possible, with the palm of your hands and suck in. The mask will likely deflate slightly. You should feel some air coming in through the cartridge but no air coming in from the sides, under your chin, or around your nose. If you do, adjust the mask and try again. If you cannot complete this step successfully, you will need either a smaller or larger mask.
      Step 3: Cover the exhalation valve of your respirator with the palm of your hand and blow out. You should feel the mask inflate slightly and again, you should feel no air escaping from the side of your mask, under your chin or around your nose.​
       
      #1 Tekenduis, Sep 21, 2010
      Last edited by a moderator: Oct 10, 2016
      • x 129
    2. How do I maintain my mask?
      Respirator maintenance is exceptionally simple, takes very little time, and ensures that you are not exposing yourself to toxins. Take the extra few minutes to ensure that your respirator is working right!

      Before you put it on

      For Disposable
      Do a quick visual check of the respirator. Is it dirty? A little discolouration from the dust is fine, but too much might mean that your respirator is clogged. I'll discuss this a bit further down. Check that your straps are still in good condition. Check that the foam piece at the nose is intact (if applicable) and that the metal part that bends across your nose is not bent out of shape. If your mask is clogged or not in good condition, replace it.

      For Half-Face
      Do a quick visual check of the inside and outside of your mask. Make sure that the valves (the little rubbery seals on the inhalation and exhalation points) are present and in good condition. Make sure there are no cracks or tears in your mask. Ensure that your filters are firmly attached. Correct any of these issues before proceeding with your work.

      After you take it off

      For disposable
      Do another quick visual check of your mask. If everything is still in order, seal your mask inside a baggie and put it somewhere safe.

      For Half-Face
      Wipe all surfaces of the mask that touch your face with a respirator cleaning wipe. If you don't have any, use the following:
      • For masks made of natural rubber, use a non-alcohol based antimicrobial wipe.
      • For masks made of silicone or plastic, wipe with isopropanol (isopropyl alcohol, or rubbing alcohol).
      This step is less about the effectiveness of your mask and more about preventing build up of oils from the skin which can degrade the mask over time, necessitating replacement, as well as causing skin breakouts!

      Seal your mask inside of a baggie or well-sealed (and clean!) coffee can and put it somewhere safe.

      Once a month you should remove the cartridges and clean your mask with soap and water, and hang it up to dry. This keeps the inside of your mask smelling pleasant. Sweat and condensation from your breathing can build up in there over time and cause the mask to smell unpleasant.

      How often do I need to replace my respirator, or cartridges?

      Filters will only last so long! Keep in mind that whether or not you are actively breathing through your respirator (IE: wearing it) it is still filtering the air around you. The average Organic Vapour filter, which is what you should be wearing at the least for spraying, lasts approximately 24–48 hours. That's it! Not very long, right?

      The good news is that you can extend the life of your filters dramatically by placing them into a sealed container, like a baggie or coffee can, as discussed in the section above. My staff generally see a lifetime of 1–2 weeks from their filters, and most staff are using their filters at least once a day.

      How do I know it's time to replace them?

      For Disposable, N95 and above
      Your respirator is a simple filter made up of layer of material that filter out small particulates from the air. Eventually your respirator will become clogged and need to be replaced. This is not a matter of time, it is a matter of volume of filtering, something not easily tracked.

      As a general rule of thumb, when your filter is ready to be replaced, you will know it because it will get harder to suck a good deep breath in. As soon as you start to feel this, replace your respirator.

      For Half-Face
      Organic Vapour Cartridge – Because this is filtering vapours (or aerosols), you will know it is time to replace it the moment you smell or taste anything through the filters; even the tiniest bit. Throw them out and get new ones.

      N95 Prefilter – Please see the explaination for disposables above, your prefilter works the same way. If your prefilter is built into your organic vapour cartridge, it's time to replace the whole thing. If you prefilter is separate and you are not tasting or smelling anything through it, replace just the prefilter.

      I've got this bandana/old respirator of my uncles/some other thing...
      Cloth is not an effective filter against either particulate or vapours.

      Your respirator needs to be yours. Quite aside from the obvious sanitation issues, if the respirator belongs to someone eles, it may not fit correctly and is therefore ineffective.

      You're just trying to scare us. No one actually gets sick from this.
      There are several people here on the forums that have stepped up to talk about the health problems that they have suffered as a result of exposure to chemicals in either this hobby or others. Before you dismiss the risks involved, please ready this story from fellow board member kayke about her health issues as a direct result of doing faceups without proper respiratory protection.

      Where do I get these things?
      Disposable respirators are readily available in home improvement stores and pharmacies; just make sure you get one that says N95, or above, as discussed earlier. You can also refer to post #3 below for a Shopping Guide.

      Half-face respirators are sometimes available in home improvement stores, but are also readily available from safety suppliers (many of which are open to the general public) and online.

      I live in Europe, what do I need to look for?
      (With special thanks to Muisje for the suggestion!)

      THIS SECTION IS CURRENTLY BEING REWORKED. Thank you for your patience. I will have it back up as quickly as possible. Please don't PM me about this for the moment; I am working as quickly as I can. Thanks!

      I worked without my mask and now I'm not feeling well. Am I going to be okay?
      I am not a medical professional. Please stop asking me this question. This question is best discussed with your Doctor. My speciality is prevention, not treatment. I can tell you what results you may incur, but I cannot and will not attempt to diagnose your health, especially not over the internet.

      I have a question for you...
      Feel free to PM me, or reply here. I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have, and if I don't know the answer, I have excellent resources for checking for you.
       
      #2 Tekenduis, Sep 21, 2010
      Last edited by a moderator: Oct 10, 2016
      • x 46
    3. Okay, I'm going to get a mask, but what do you recommend?

      I use 3M products exclusively, and I am very happy with them. 3M is one of the largest companies out there. They're available worldwide, and the chances of them ever going out of business, therefore forcing you to buy new equipment, is very slim. My recommendations are as follows, along with links for online purchasing! I never recommend buying (or using) second-hand safety gear.

      This list is only partial. I will add to it as I find time.

      Please note that at this time, these are US/Canada based websites and recommendations. If you are from another country, please let me know and I will do my best to find your country's equivalants.

      Disposable Respirators ("Dust Masks")

      3M 8210
      Lowes 20-pack | Home Depot 20-pack


      3M 8210 Plus
      As above, but with a fabric elacstic strap, so they last longer, but tend to be a bit more expensive.
      Lowes 20 pack | Home Depot 2-pack | Home Depot 20-pack | Amazon 20-pack


      3M 8511
      Similar to the 8210 series, but these have an exhalation valve, which can prove more comfortable in hot or humid environments.
      Lowes 10-pack | Home Depot 10-pack | Amazon 10-pack


      Half-Face Respirators (Rubber)

      3M 6000 Series Half-Face Respirator
      Amazon (Small) | Amazon (Medium)

      3M 6001 Organic Vapour Cartridges & 3M 5N11 N95 Prefilters
      Home Depot Resupply Kit (OV Cartridges and Prefilters) | Amazon Organic Vapour Cartridges | Amazon Resupply Kit (OV Cartridges and Prefilters)

      Starter Kits
      Lowes (Medium) | Home Depot (Large) | Home Depot (Medium) | Amazon (Medium) | Amazon (Large)


      Half-Face Respirators (Silicon)

      3M 7500 Series Half-Face Respirator
      Amazon (Small) | Amazon (Medium) | Amazon (Large)

      3M 6001 Organic Vapour Cartridges & 3M 5N11 N95 Prefilters
      (Please see above! These are the same as for the 3M 6000 series)

      Starter Kits
      Lowes (Medium) | Amazon (Small) | Amazon (Medium) | Amazon (Large)
       
      #3 Tekenduis, Sep 21, 2010
      Last edited by a moderator: Oct 10, 2016
      • x 35
    4. Thank you very much for this!!!
      I used a FFP1 mask for sanding. Most of the time i sanded wet but not the whole time and the dust flew around then... Do I have to be scared now? ÓÒ
       
    5. Lanilu The difference between an FFP1 and FFP2 mask for sanding purposes is mostly based on the level of dust in the atmosphere and the type of dust being kicked up. For hand sanding the FFP1 is recommended while FFP2 is recommended for machine sanding (like working with a dremel). When I made my recommendation it was based on having a higher level of protection than recommended by the guidelines in order to ensure that you're safe no matter what you're doing.

      You've taken important steps to protect yourself already and I don't think that you have anything at all to be afraid of. (I've also sent you this information via PM for your piece of mind.)
       
      • x 2
    6. Thanks for all the information. About how much would a half-face respirator cost? I don't plan on doing loads of face-ups. I just would like to add a bit on a doll I have coming in soon. I don't really want to have to spend a lot on a mask I'm going to use once o.o
       
      • x 1
    7. Diamond Eyes It really depends on what you get and your location. Generally, a rubber or plastic based mask is going to cost less than a silicon based mask will. It is actually possible to get a half-face mask that has the cartridges permanantly attached. In this case you'd only be able to use it until the cartridges were worn out. This is an option for you, although honestly it will cost about the same as getting a resuable half-face mask. Generally speaking you should budget between $20-40 for the mask, and another $10-20 for the cartridges and filters.
       
      • x 1
    8. Ugh I should have totally read this earlier. I've only been using those little green paper-like masks and I do feel sick anyway. I do a tremendous amount of sanding and I have various reactions to the resin dust from different companies. I have gotten hives, headaches and nausia.
      I think it's time I invest in a real mask.
      Thank you so much for this advice.
       
      • x 2
    9. northern_raven It'll be worth it for you to invest in a good mask. If you've been getting hives and stuff from the resin, there's a possibility that you've developed a sensitivity to it. You may want to look at getting yourself a half-face, whether you're using MSC or not. A half-face with the Organic Vapour Cartridges and N95 prefilters are more than usually needed for sanding, but you may find that it makes you more comfortable and less likely to react to it. You may want to also look at getting yourself some nitrile gloves to keep the dust off of your skin. Sometimes sensitivities can get worse with further exposure.
       
      • x 4
    10. Thankfully the little mom n' pop hardware store near my house carries some proper dust masks. Sadly they didn't stock any in my size so I grabbed the mask that looked most likely to fit. It is by Degil and has a N95 rating. These are great because although it is disposable it has adjustable straps so you can tighten the mask. I had to mod the straps further so that I could get the fit right. Infact I might even suggest it to the company.

      I will be using rubber gloves from now on too and long sleeves.

      Thank you so much for this information. You might have saved me from lung cancer! *hugs*
       
      • x 1
    11. I'm probably going to get a huge amount of disapproval for this, but..is it really absolutely necessary to wear a respirator when using MSC, if you only plan on using it once or twice? I definitely would use one, but I just dread telling my parents I actually need to get one of them for this...I can just imagine them rolling their eyes. What if I spray it away from my face and leave quickly? How much damage could be caused if I only do this maybe once or twice a year?
       
    12. northern_raven - I'm glad that you were able to find something so close by! The brand doesn't matter so much as the rating on the mask. In order for them to actually be able to put that rating on the mask it must undergo vigorous outside testing for approval.

      AlexaJ - Feel free to have your parents read through this guide if they roll the eyes at the necessity of you having a mask. Masks are cheap. Your lungs and central nervous system are irreplaceable.

      How much damage can be caused if you only do this once or twice a year? The simple answer to that is "enough to kill you". You need to take this seriously. There is no "get out of jail free" level where you're okay if you only do it once or only once or twice. Are you aware that overexposure to sealants just once can put you in a prolonged coma and even kill you?
       
      • x 6
    13. It isn't that I don't take this seriously, it's just that I never use these types of things and am only just getting into BJDs- I had /no/ idea it was neccessary to use a respirator for the longest time, and it never really seemed to be mentioned, and it appears that a lot of people neglect to use them. I knew that to sand resin you would need one, I was shocked because this is the first time I've seen anything discussing how dangerous MSC and such were and if I hadn't seen it, I would've been obliviously spraying it with no protection. So I just wondered how it could be so important when no one seems to mention this! I am very grateful you wrote this, even if it didn't seem it ^^; Like I said, I was just stressed out that I never knew this and would have used MSC without a mask. So thank you. I will definitely get one now, despite my parents exasperation. :)
       
      • x 2
    14. Tekenduis is something thats labeled as being NIOSH approved: OV/P100 proper for spraying? Most of the masks that I've been looking though seem to come with a dizzying array of letters and number attached to them...

      Many thanks for put up this topic, I knew that resin dust was harmful (but still didn't know the proper precautions), but that most of our sprays were also harmful never really crossed my mind. Thank goodness I saw this!
       
    15. AlexaJ - I'm also shocked at how little mention is made of exactly how dangerous things like MSC can actually be to your health. It seemed that often when it was mentioned, it was done so as an afterthought, and there was a lot of confusion surrounding what could be used, what couldn't. I started this thread in the hopes of clearing up some of the misinformation and making modification a safer passtime for everyone involved in it. :)

      commonfish - OV is Organic Vapour and P100 means that it is Oil Proof and able to filter 99.7% of particles under 0.3 microns from the air. The OV cartridge is exactly what you need for spraying and the P100 prefilter is actually a little more than you need. Your mask will cover you for the sprays that you're using for doll stuff, but it can also be used for oil-based paint spraying as well (just in case that's something you ever do.) You're covered!
       
    16. Thank you for all the great information- really good to see some facts from someone who knows!

      Something else people should be aware of is that pastels also become a fine dust that can get into our respiratory system. I've spoken with fine artists before who have themselves, or had friends, develop respiratory problems from long term pastel use. If you have a mask you're comfortable wearing, would be wise to leave it on for any heavy pastel work!
       
      • x 5
    17. Thank you so much for posting this! I do face ups and while I knew breathing in the fumes wasn't good for your brain I never thought about my lungs! A quick question or two: 1)maybe I'm just hopeful since I dont want to shell out the big bucks for a half-face respirator but will the disposable be good enough for spraying testors/msc if you can't smell anything? 2)should I be worried about second hand spray? 3) what about animals breathing this stuff?
       
    18. Bird of Hermes - Thank you for this excellent information. We don't work with pastels in my workplace and I'm not familiar with them myself. It's definitely a wise idea to use a mask for pastel work, in that case, and I would recommend an N95 respirator (such as the type you use for sanding) in this case.

      Kieran66 - Thanks for your questions. I'm happy to answer them for you!
      1) No, unfortunately, the disposable ones are not good enough for spraying MSC or Testors. You need a half-face respirator for these products, as you need to have an Organic Vapour cartridge; an N95 filter isn't enough. The good news is that you can pick up very good masks (exactly the type I use in my hazardous workplace) at Lowe's and Home Depot for around $30.
      2) Aerosols from the spray (the part that is actually hazardous) can affect other people in the area with you while you are spraying. If someone else is working with you or observing, they need to be in respiratory protection as well. Keep people without respiratory protection out of the area for at least 30 minutes to an hour after you have sprayed.
      3) Animals are even more likely to be negatively affected by spray products than humans are, as a result of their smaller size. Please keep your animals out of the area in which you are spraying for at least 30 minutes to an hour after you're finished.
       
      • x 3
    19. So even if I only spray MSC outside I need a half face respirator? My partner sprays MSC inside a small room with mostly closed windows and then doesn't leave and I just called to scold her about it.
       
      • x 1
    20. Thanks for the useful thread!

      I had a question though. I wanted to actually burn some resin to create...well...burn mods. I figured I'd need a half-face respirator...but I didn't know there were different kinds of cartridges! What kind would I use for burning resin?
       
    21. Thanks for this great info, Tekenduis! I think it would be perfectly acceptable for you to recommend some brands you prefer here. Folks do the same for sprays and pastels, at least. Also, to second what Bird of Hermes has said- my painting prof once told me that pastel artists are notoriously short lived! Use a mask with pastels, and gloves for any pastel/paint with toxic ingredients.
       
    22. Thank you so much for this post! I have a question Tekenduis > u<

      I live in a rather small apartment, and I don't have much space to work with save for a little area near the balcony. I do intend to set up my work space near the balcony so if I do spray the MSC, most of it will probably flow out of the house.

      What I'm concerned with is that I have a 10-year-old brother running around the house most of the time, and while he doesn't sit right beside me while I work, I definitely don't want him to be harmed in any manner.

      What sort of distance should he be keeping while I'm spraying the MSC, and how long should the area be steered clear of to ensure that all harmful particles are gone and we can all breathe normally without getting into trouble without a respirator? @_@

      Finally, would it be altogether better if I get a box or something, and just confine the spraying to the box?
       
      • x 2
    23. A very very valuable source of information Tekenduis! Thank you SO much for posting this, as health is very important to us all!

      A question, what type of filter should I use when casting resin? It doesn't produce a scent, but I heard it nonetheless produces toxic fumes while it's setting?

      ~*Mystaia
       
    24. enginesoftime - Yep! You really need a half-face respirator whenever you're working with MSC, even if you're outside.

      ImpmomsTrueTamer101 - I would strongly recommend that you find another way to do the mods that you wish to create. Burning resin can off-gas Cyanide Gas. We have burned resin for testing purposes in our shop, but always in a paint spray booth and using supplied air, not ever a cartridge.

      There are cartridges created for dealing with Cyanide Gases, but these are Chemical and Biological Warfare cartridges and are far outside of the scope of what I can comfortably advice you on.

      jadepixel - Thanks for seconding what Bird of Hermes said! I'll think about adding something into the article with some brand recommendations. :)

      Elliryn - I'm afraid that I can't really give you a firm answer on how far away, distance-wise, someone should be, or how long it takes for the vapours to go down because there are many factors that can change the answer to that and without knowing these things, I can't really answer appropriately.

      I would strongly recommend doing your actual spraying out on the balcony instead of inside of your apartment or getting your brother fit for a respirator as well and staying in it for 30 minutes to an hour after spraying.

      Mystaia - Thanks for your question! When casting resin in small batches, you may be able to use the same type of cartridge/prefilter combination that you use for spraying MSC. That is, Organic Vapour with an N95 prefilter. This is what our casting and molding department uses. It does, however, depend on whether or not your particular type of resin uses Isocyanates. Check your MSDS sheets for the resin manufacturer's recommendation. Without seeing the sheets I can't advise you properly.

      If you know what you're using I may be able to find the MSDS sheets and check it out for you, especially if you're using Smooth-On products.
       
      • x 2
    25. Thank you very much for this. Until now I thought: I will be careful, don't breath very much and then I won't need a protection; but that convinced me XD
      So, if I sand resin I only need a normal respirator, the white one? (on the right in your picture)
      And if I spray MSC, do i really need the half-face-respirator, also if I spray very fast, outside, wear the disposable respirator, don't breath and then go as far away as possible? Well, probably yes, but... everything is so expensive...
      I also think that this definitely should be made a Sticky!
       
      • x 1
    26. Oh wow, and I didn't even know that I should be wearing masks for pastel works....I love working with pastels for my art and I've also used Conté chalks which makes powder...Maybe I should start thinking about investing in some masks, even though I'm not even in the doll hobby yet, I think it would be a good investement as an artist.

      So if I read well(english ain't my mother language), a mask for pastel works and one for sealants like Krylon are different right? I'll take a few notes and see if I can find some masks....or I might ask my father, he worked in garages before, maybe he knows more about that than me.

      Also, I suspect that Canadian masks and American masks are very similar? I live in Quebec by the way, sometimes welovebeingdifferent ahah~


      Thanks you very much for sharing all of this though. I'm not in the doll hobby yet since I'm broke, but that's information that can be very useful for any kind of artist. Plus, masks are always awesome looking :lol:. As soon as I have the time I'll start shopping for one, I don't really know a brand or anything, but I'll make notes on what you recommend and I'll try to find them.
       
    27. Mystaia - Thanks for checking in on those MSDS sheets for me. Section 8 on these MSDS sheets are concerned with exposure control and personal protection. Looks like they want you to be in a well ventilated area. They recommend nitrile gloves (and since you're working with hazardous materials, I definitely recommend this as well!) and they want you to have Organic Vapour Cartridges and a HEPA Filter. So, what you need are Organic Vapour Cartriges with an P100 filter, rather than the N95 you'd need for spraying MSC.

      You're in the UK, though, so rather than a P100 filter, you need to look for a prefilter marked FFP3.

      Hope this helps!

      Miluriel - Unfortunately, this sort of "careful" is not actually protecting you at all. If you're sanding resin you need a disposable respirator; if you're using MSC you'll need a half-face, because disposable respirators with Organic Vapour protection are simply not made.

      If you're worried about the expense, you can buy a half-face respirator and use it for both sanding and spraying MSC, as it will protect you well for both applications!

      Ophexis - Salut, Ophexis. J'adore la belle province. Votre Anglais est meilleur que mon Francais. ;)

      I'm from Alberta. The Canadian and American masks are marked exactly the same way. If you have Home Depot or Lowe's in Quebec, you should be able to pick up N95 respirators there easily; I believe both place carry 3M. I'm not aware of any other brands they might have.
       
      • x 1
    28. Thanks Tekenduis! I am so glad you've told me this!!

      If I use a P100 or FFP3 filter, will that also be good enough for MSC and sanding? (Though I may get separate ones anyway, if it's cheaper.)

      Doing a search on amazon, I've come up with loads of FFP3 masks that are disposable! Even though they say EN149... I don't think they'll be good enough against vapour! Can't seem to be able to find any FFP3 half-masks that are against vapour & gases. The ones I can find, use a different rating system.

      A - Organic Vapour & Gases
      B - Inorganic Vapour & Gases
      E - Sulphur Dioxide & Other Acidic Vapour & Gases
      K - Amonia & Amonia Derivatives
      ABEK - All of the above
      P - Dust Filter

      Also, there seems to be an A1 and an A2 in this rating system. P1, P2, and P3. Often masks come with something like AB1P1 ratings, presumebly meaning that they have an organic/inorganic filter capacity and they filter to a P1 degree - 80% of airborne particles? I'm gonna guess that for spraying with MSC I'll need an A1-P2 filter? Or would it be an A2 filter? And for casting resin an AB-P3 filter? Or an AB3 filter (don't know if they exist)?

      ~*Mystaia
       
    29. WOW!!! Thankyou so much for providing this very helpful & lifesaving information!!!
      I found it pretty scary to tell the truth!
      I have been using Testors for over a year now regularly and have sprayed outside holding my breath!
      I then bring the head back inside to dry away from dust and stuff and my hubby & kids always complain how bad it smells.
      I feel terrible now that I may have exposed them to its effects as well as myself :-(
      I will definately not be spraying again til I have the right mask and I will need to find somewhere to let my heads dry outside!!!
      Thanks again!
       
    30. Thank you for this wonderful thread! :D

      I don't own a doll yet but I have been doing some research to see if I really want to take the plunge! I've been almost completely put off by dolls (despite how awesome they are! D: ) when i learned how toxic msc is and how easily it can harm you. But now that i found a reputable thread about protection i feel like i can really learn how to use it without putting my family in danger! ^__^

      Your response on page 3 to Kieran66 really helped me but I still wanna touch base on a few things from there, and some other questions(I really know nothing about chemical sprays.):

      Where can i find the ingredients?
      What about it makes it so toxic?

      After 30min to and hour wait the threat is gone because the spray or the chemicals in the spray have settled?
      Is that the only reason msc is unsafe?
      Once msc dries on a surface how toxic is it? (does a threat always linger?)

      Like how alcohol can clean a face-up off, can i use it to sanitize a surface sprayed with msc?
      How dangerous is it to the environment?(Not sure if this is answerable? really cool to know though.)

      If i were to get a doll at the moment my spraying area would be my garage,its spacious, no one really goes in there, and i can open the door to vent! I would probably set up some cloth behind the doll parts to catch any msc from sticking to the floor and other things or perhaps set the parts in a box to use msc? (..lol and I'd move my cat food out of there too.)

      Sorry for all the questions and I really hope this thread becomes a sticky!!
       
    31. tangy_melon I hope I can answer at least some of your questions!

      Where can I find the ingredients?

      It should be possible to find a Materials Safety Data Sheet (MSDS) for products that you are using. Ask for these to be provided to you when you buy!

      What about it makes it so toxic?

      The chemical composition of the product and the way that it reacts to your body is what makes the product toxic to you. This sort of question is better asked of someone with a medical background for more specific information, though. If you want to discuss it with a medical professional, bring the above-mentioned MSDS sheet with you!

      After 30min to and hour wait the threat is gone because the spray or the chemicals in the spray have settled?

      After this time, the aerosols in the air should have settled out of the air, meaning that you are no longer exposed to them when you breathe.

      Is that the only reason msc is unsafe?
      Once msc dries on a surface how toxic is it? (does a threat always linger?)


      MSC is inert once it is dry, unless, for example, you are sanding it, in which case you are dealing with dust particles, which are dangerous as well. If you're simply playing with your dolls the MSC is safe.

      Like how alcohol can clean a face-up off, can i use it to sanitize a surface sprayed with msc?

      If you get overspray on surfaces in the area you're working and you want to clean it up, alcohol should work, but it will depend on the surface you're working on. If you're worried about getting overspray on surfaces in your workarea, you may want to consider building yourself a spray box. This doesn't have to be anything complex! A cardboard box with the top and one side cut out is more than enough.

      How dangerous is it to the environment?

      I'm sorry. I'm not qualified to answer that question. I don't know anything about the environmental effects of MSC.


      Definitely move the cat food out of the garage. Leave your garage door partially or completely open, keep pets and people out of the area when you're working and use your respirator. Do all of that and you've taken every precaution I would suggest to keep yourself safe!

      Enjoy the hobby!
       
    32. Thank you so much for this. I usually just tie a damp cloth over my face and hold my breath, but clearly that won't keep working for long. Once again, thank you for compiling this advice, I'll definitely start searching for a mask now.

      EDIT: Didn't want to double post. Thank you shou-kun for finding that mask. I'll be ordering it. :)
       
    33. Hello! This thread is amazing! I have asthma and allergies, but am wanting to try doing faceups in the very near future, so I want to do everything I can to protect myself. I've read through this thread and I feel like I know what I'm looking for, but I want to be certain the mask I get will provide all the protection I need.

      I found this one on Amazon and the details seem to match up with those in this thread, but I was wondering if anyone could confirm this for me. I'm just afraid I'll miss something and buy a mask that isn't what I need. Any help is much appreciated!
       
    34. shou-kun - Exactly what you need. That is one of the two models that my guys use in our workplace environment (the other model is a more expensive one by the same company, and made of silicon.)
       
    35. I accidently inhaled some dust yesterday, and I feel sick
       
    36. @Azukiredbean - Eep, I hope you're feeling better! Was there a lot of dust in the air? Was it floating around or quickly settling down? Either way you should contact your doctor immediately or go to the emergency room if you're having trouble breating or feel really sick. I'm not sure what to say, I know that resin dust is toxic but I'm not sure how much of it you have to breathe in before you start having major problems. I don't want you freaking out but I also don't want you to brush off any respiratory problems you may have.

      Promise you'll take care of yourself ok?
       
    37. Wow! Great dose of info. I put my respirator up where I'll see it in the morning on my way out. I've had it for over a year and at the moment can't recall the last filter change. I had no idea they "worked" while you weren't actively putting air through it (not that I've used it since the fall).
       
    38. Thanks so much for this thread! Like most people I tend to stand upwind, hold my breath, spray and run when using MSC >.< but last week I had one sleeve rolled up and the wind suddenly changed direction, the skin on my arm went red and tight and it really scared me. I washed it with dishwashing liquid and hot water and it seemed to be fine after a little while, but it was definitely a kick up the bum to be more careful, I'll go and get a mask at the weekend.

      I have a question about animals; I always make sure to take my cats inside before I spray, but last week I left my dolls' heads outside drying and looked out the window to find a robin hopping around them. I chased it away but I'm really worried now, would that affect wild birds very badly? It can't really be avoided like with pets :(
       
    39. @Tekenduis Bless you for creating this and helping spread the vital information that can help protect many people in the future.

      After all ladies and gents, I hope to never see any of you cross paths with me in the hospital suffering from one of the things Tekenduis mentioned in the first post, all because one was careless and an idiot. Life is far to short to risk your health for, especially for something so vital to you, breathing. Weather it is this hobby or any other, ALWAYS wear whatever PPE that you should be wearing for it, cause trust me the price to pay for the equipment and its maintenance to keep it in working condition FAR OUTWEIGHS the cost of the medical bills for the damage done to your body due to stupidity and carelessness....and trust me some of these conditions that are result of chemical and dust exposure can be painful as you slowly die from them. Like Tekenduis said, the sobering truth of this isn't there to scare you, but to remind you that playing Russian Roulette with your health is not worth it....

      @shou-kun I will concur with Tekenduis on your choice. In fact I use the same half mask respirator for home use as a hobbyist...

      And I will agree with a lot of what Tekenduis has said. I work in a hospital myself, even though I only work in the kitchen, I understand the dangers of the chemicals we use and so on (and I actually have access to the MSDS sheets), and have seen the effects of such things and what it can do to people firsthand through the patients whom have come in over the years for conditions like or similar to the ones Tekenduis mentioned.

      I myself as a hospital employee have access to if I wish to a professional fit testing for masks like these, as its my right under OSHA, since there may be a time when I might need to wear such a mask in my professional life, such as during a major disaster or if treating and serving or dealing with a chemical accident or biological accident.
      Most masks will come with instructions on how to fit test yourself with them properly and such (read this information VERY CAREFULLY!!!), though if you ever have the opportunity to get it done professionally, go for it, cause making sure you know what mask and size works best for you and your facial structure can be valuable information. If you cannot do so professionally, then defiantly read and follow any instructions packed with the mask carefully and follow them...Also for something like this, NEVER toss out the information!!! Usually the papers that come with this, not only tell you how to properly fit test yourself for the mask, but will usually have other important data, such as how often the cartridges should be replaced, how to do it, and even what type of replacement cartridge you need to replace used or expended cartridges. Usually the place you purchased your mask would be a good start for replacements, as they would likely make sure that they also carry the replacement cartridges for masks they sell in stock, or would be able to order them for you.

      In fact if you go to the bottom of this page (http://www.ilpi.com/msds/index.html), you can find a few sites where you can find MSDS (or Material Safety Data Sheets) online for pretty much any chemical out there. Many you can sign up for a free trial and stuff, though for the small fee they might charge after the trial ends, it will be well worth having such valuable data at your fingertips, as you can search for ANY chemical or hazardous product period, even stuff like Windex. MSDS, include everything from general hazard data, combustibility, health hazards (very valuable for those with existing respiratory issues like asthma), special precautions, a full ingredient list , as well as how to handle cleanup of the material if a large spill or incident occurs so to make sure that the chemical is fully and properly cleaned up so as not to leave lasting damage to your property or residual damage that can affect ones health...
      The first one in that list of sites (http://www.msdsonline.com/) is probably your best bet as that is the pretty much official MSDS site, which I know cause its the site listed on the poster above the book we have of MSDS sheets for our workplace, since the site will also usually also have some of the more up to date data on the chemicals as new info is released on them. You can search most of these for free though, need to make an account to view/print up the data....
      From what I can see it cost's about $149 a year for the most basic account which is mostly for like small businesses or those who only need to pull up small amounts of sheets...a little hefty, but at same time, a heck of a lot cheaper then what it costs for say on visit to the ER....(mind ya average trip to ER, depending on ones insurance co-pay is at least $100 bucks, plus whatever one insurance doesn't cover, which can be over $1,000 really quick)
      So yes folks, defiantly check out the site above and after your trial ends and can afford the fee, go for it, cause as I mentioned above, the fee to access such valuable data on handling chemicals, hazardous or not safely, is going to be worth it....must less then the price of the hospital and playing Russian Roulette with your health....:)
       
      • x 1
    40. Hi there,

      I've scanned the thread but haven't found the answer to my question (unless I missed it)-- Is it safe to spray MSC/Testor's/Zoukei-mura inside in a well-ventilated room as long as you wear a mask? Is it safe for sanding, too? Or is it best to be outside?

      Thank you very much for this helpful post! The whole thread is wonderfully informative :)
       
    41. I would assume it would be alright if you have no other viable choice (or it just extremely cold, which can also affect how the stuff sprays and dries), though going outside would be the best option, mask regardless of in or out.... Make sure the room is well ventilated, and run a fan if needed. Do not allow pets or anyone else in the room without protection at least till the vapors dissipate, and the smell has dissipated as well, since the vapors or even the smell can cause some problems. Some may just get nauseated from the smell of the stuff.
      I have done this on occasion if it was far too cold out to spray and such, but try and stick with going outside when I can, and left the head dry outside, unless its too cold for it to dry right, then I bring it in, but won't let people near the area heads are drying till dry and smell has dissipated.

      I shall though let Tekenduis give you an answer as well, as she may have a better answer and thoughts on the matter. :)
       
    42. @ Sunflower, I think it depends on what you mean by "ventilated". If it's just a few windows open, I'd say no. I do a lot of my current spraywork out in the garage, but that is a very large door to open, so it's more like being just under a roof. Most "spray rooms" as I understand and have seen are small, are able to be closed, and have an industrial fan/vacuum pulling air immediately out though a built in airway system that leads directly outside. The fumes from this stuff can sit around for hours (especially when you are doing sprays between layers) and it's really nasty if it gets on anything you care about.

      Also, a question for anyone out there. How often do you have to buy a new respirator because the company decided to stop selling? I had an AO Saftey respirator, could always get the cartridges at the Lowe's near me, but then I moved, and no where in the area sells this brand anymore. I can only get the 3M brand stuff now.
       
    43. Just a piece of info I just learned: the R95/OV Respirator by "MSA Safety Works" is a good one for filtering MSC sprays.
       
    44. Chibi Kitsunne - Sounds like you may have had a small contact allergic reaction to the MSC. It might be worth keeping a bottle of calamine lotion around the house just in case, because it will help to calm the irritation quickly. You had exactly the right reaction, though, wash the contacted skin thoroughly and if it's irritated, itchy, tight, red or anything, get some calamine on it to help it settle down a bit. If the irritation persists, go to the doc, but usually skin irritation will calm down within an hour or two.

      About animals: Chances are the robin that you saw is not going to be affected by the MSC. If the heads were outside, the aerosols released by spraying are going to dissipate pretty quickly and unless an animal were to injest the MSC in this situation, I would think it unlikely to cause them any harm. If you're concerned about it, though, you could always do something like put a container over them after you're done spraying. Something like a plastic food container should do the trick, but don't use it for food after!

      Raiji Magiwind - Thanks very much! I appreciate what you'd added to the thread with this information. I've actually been trying to find official MSDS sheets for some of the more common products we deal with and would like to host and link them when I do find them, but life got very busy for a while there and I haven't had a lot of time to update this thread.

      There are some big updates coming though!

      sunflower - With some reservations, yes. The room needs to be extremely well ventilated - multiple windows and actual air movement (like from a breeze outside). I've given some tips and suggestions for how to do this, but setting a fan up in the window (pointing outside so it's sucking your spray out of the room) and working right next to it can definitely help. You will absolutely need to use respiratory protection in this case.

      I would highly recommend against doing this in shared housing (apartment buildings, roommates, family, etc) and in a home with pets.

      It is important that you allow time for the particulates or aerosols to settle out of the air before removing your mask.

      Always, though, outside or in a large ventilated semi-outdoor area (like a partially enclosed porch or garage) is best.


      Ice Mutt - I'm sorry to hear that AO has decided to stop selling. There's nothing more frustrating in the world than having your respirator company go out of business.

      3M is always a safe bet. They're one of the biggest companies out there - and not just for safety gear either. 3M isn't going anywhere and they're widely available and very reliable. Since AO is no longer selling the right stuff for you, I would recommend moving to 3M. I use nothing but 3M products in my workplace for the above reasons.
       
    45. Oh gosh, I had no idea @_@ this is really good to know! Especially since I plan on doing my own faceups...
      I want to know though, is it even possible to buy the needed equipment in way-smaller-than-average-15-year-old size? O_o And if I had somebody else do the spraying, would there be danger in waiting for it to dry and then painting without a mask? My dad actually owns masks that work and fit him, and it would probably be cheaper than buying a new one anyway >< would it be ok if I used a disposable mask, or is that bad too? Because it would be REALLY nice if I could just spray myself...
       
    46. Hi Frogg!

      It is possible to buy for people with small faces, believe me. I have a small face myself. You need to look for a mask that's marked as a size small.

      If you want to get your dad to do it for you, that's fine, and once the MSC is dry it is inert and safe to work around without a mask.

      Unfortunately with MSC you cannot use a disposable mask. Disposable masks are design to remove particulates from the air. The danger in MSC involves aerosols and a disposable mask will not protect you.

      If you have any more questions, please feel free to ask, either here or you can PM me if you're more comfortable.
       
    47. What if I can't get my hands on a Repirator? (is that whats it's called? xD) Can I use a normal white mask for spraying? Also, I cannot spray outside and have to extra rooms in my house so is it safe to do it in a room with 2 open windows and 2 stand up fans? Also is it safe to do it in the room your doing the face up in?? ;_;
       
    48. sugaryunicorns -

      "What if I can't get my hands on a Respirator?" - If you cannot get a respirator, then you should not be spraying MSC. I won't give advice on spraying without a respirator.

      Respirators are inexpensive and easy to find. If your local hardware or safety supplies store does not carry respirators, you can easily order one online. They should not be considered an optional part of your equipment any more than you would consider a paintbrush, paint or MSC itself to be optional.

      "Can I use a normal white mask for spraying?" - No. If you look at my reply immediately above yours, you will see that I have covered the reasons why this is not an acceptable substitute already.

      "...safe to do in a room with 2 open windows and 2 stand up fans?" - It is not "safe", but it is "safer" than doing it without any ventilation at all. This sort of set up is never ideal and should not be done if others are inside the home (family, roommates, pets, etc). This assumes, of course, that you and anyone occupying the space with you are wearing respirators.
       
    49. Thank you very very much! :) I'm going sometime this week to look are for one, Hopefully I'll be able to! And my room where I will be doing it in will have no one around but me, Thats for sure.

      Thanks again!
       
    50. Quoting this again for emphasis. Also, please take a look at post #83 above where I go into more detail about what I really mean here.
       
    51. I'm a bit confused about something and was wanting a little bit of clarification: A lot of the masks I'm finding are called Dust/Vapour masks and say that they can filter dust, organic vapours and 'nuisance vapours'.

      I was just wondering what that meant?

      The mask I had in mind to get (I'm going to be working with MSC or similar aerosols, for my own personal use) was called a 3M "Pro-Val 30129 P2 Dust and Vapour Mask with Valve"Is this mask going to be okay, or do I need to get a different one?
       
    52. Sorry about that, I looked back on posts after I've posted it. I was figuring I could do it in a ventilated room that isn't around others since the weather is pretty horrible here(snow,Rain,Even more snow,and even more rain) But I do have a Roofed Porch (you probably know what I mean) So I will actually use that instead of endangering my self and my family.

      Also I have found and bought a Respirator today! Thank you for your help!
       
    53. Chibihaku - Hi! Sorry it's taken me a bit to answer this. I'm not that familiar with the standards in Australia so I had to look some things up for you. The mask you've referenced here is not actually good enough for spraying MSC, unfortunately. It does protect against certain types of particulates and mists, but is more of the sort of thing that's meant for nuisance level Organic Vapour, and applications like welding.

      What you'll need to look for in Australia is a mask that's rated A1P2. This will give you organic vapour protection at an appropriate level. You're going to need to look into a half-face respirator for this. 3M makes several different models of these.

      Since you referenced a 3M mask, I'm going to stick to 3M recommendations. I use 3M myself and am very pleased with them.

      Look for a 3M 6000 series or 7500 series mask. The cartridges you need (A1) are 3M 6051. The prefilters you need (P2) are 3M 5925.

      I know that here we can get this exact mask/cartridge/prefilter combination at our big box hardware stores (Home Depot, Lowes, etc) so you may want to try one of these types of stores first. :)

      sugaryunicorns - Excellent. Roofed porch is a great place to work. :)
       
    54. I live in a house with family and pets, is there anything I can do to keep them safe if I need to spray MSC? (I would be wearing a respirator)
       
    55. noozie - Answered you via PM, since you had a slightly longer question there. My advice is that it's best to work outside if there are other housemates and pets in the equation.

      $abbatha - I believe that Europe uses the same regulations as Australia. Look for a filter that's A1P2. If that's not available, P2 at the very least, but you may find that you have to replace it a bit more often than a A1P2.
       
    56. Thanks Dear!
      No problem in replacing it often,i will do,i don't know if A1P2 is avaible...
      Question:
      i may change the filter basing on needs:
      if i sand resin P2
      if i spray MSC A1
      or the converse,no?
      It won't works in that way?
       
    57. $abbatha - Eeep, sorry. I didn't check my post properly.

      I said:
      "If that's not available, P2 at the very least"
      But I should have said:
      "If that's not available, A1 at the very least"

      Sorry for my confusion!

      So, if you need to get two different filterrs A1 is for Spraying MSC and P2 would be for sanding. :)
       
    58. Thank You very Much!!!
      Tomorrow shopping people :)
       
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